NYPD exam 3319 expected wait?
Hello everyone. I took the NYPD exam 3319 back in June 2013. I got a 76 which is low and I'm kind of nervous. I'm hoping I'll still be able to get hired within a few years. I still don't have a list number, but considering I scored lowly I would presume I will be roughly 4xxx I am currently 19 years old and in college. I want to finish my bachelors within 3.5 years as opposed to 4, hoping that I will get the call when I am 21/22. Although I did score lowly on the test, do you think at this rate I'll be following through with the process by 2016? If all goes as planned and I finish my bachelors by December of 2015 it would be ideal to go into the January 16 or July 16 academy class. What do you guys think? Do you think I'll even get the call, and should I take the test again? Thanks!
Alike to yourself, I took the exam back in the late spring this year. I'm actually 24 though. I have some friends on the job who gave good advice about the long the process generally takes. I'll share some of their advice with you. And as a graduate student, I also have valuable advice regarding school. But as for your question for getting on the job, note that this is subject to change with question marks like budget issues and how many people retire within the next few years.
Originally Posted by thebest385
To start, do not get too nervous about a 76. Granted, it isn't that great of a score, but from what I know, when you take the test matters more for those who passed than the ranking of the score, with the NYPD exam. With other more competitive departments to get into like sanitation and I imagine the FD and MTA too, your test score matters more. Their lists have gotten so backed up that lists get condense together from different time periods, which means they need to reshuffle the rankings based on test scores.
With the NYPD, even though the test is offered almost every day and despite many people taking the exam, the job has a high rate of people who either do not want the job (i.e. wind up getting another city job, moving to another state and not wanting to move back or going to college and getting another good job) or disqualify (most common reason not having the 60 credits when they are called, other reasons include poor credit, poor driving records, criminal convictions, people who may not have citizenship at the moment who project having it when the NYPD calls but do not receive it by than, ect). That is before excluding those who don't pass the medical or psychological. Despite all this though, so many people have taken the exam that the list is projected to be 2-3 years backed up. I had a friend who took the exam in March '08 and got in the summer academy in '10. Alike to us, my friend was hired post-recession with the budget concerns, so this is about average or a little quicker than average.
Now lets talk about college. A lot of people give advice to stay in school, don't get in trouble, keep good credit and don't get fired from a job. I'm going to take it an extra step to say really do go to college and study something that gives you versatility. A lot of people who want to become cops study criminal justice or criminology. Unless you decide to do that at the graduate level and want to become a professor whether before or after a police career, don't go for that (unless you are a cadet and they require you to for them to pay for it). I say that because you'll learn it in the academy. Others take sociology which I'd say the same thing for. Still very theoretical and criminology is virtually a branch of it.
Ask yourself a big question, what is another career I can see myself doing besides being a police officer? The NYPD is so big that you might even be able to apply that skill within the department. Say you want to become a social sciences teacher. Study to become that. Whether as a second career or if you don't like the job or if you get hurt, you can get a teaching job (although you'll need an MA to teach in NY and it'd be wise to do an MAT if not an education undergrad or M.eD if you were). You can also become an instructor in the academy (even while as a sergeant or lieutenant if you make that rank). Or say you would consider becoming a lawyer. Prelaw is an option. If you are really good with computers, computer science is a very valued skill. Other good real world applicable fields are accounting, nursing, business administration and public administration.
You mentioned you want to get through school in 3.5 years. Assuming you didn't need any prep/remedial math or reading courses, unless you do 5 or 6 classes per semester or do not mind going for 1-2 classes per summer semester and never drop or fail a course and do not work a second job more than about 15-20 hours a week at max, expect it to be very hard and to either have none to little social life or to be so exhausted on your free time that you don't want to go out. If you try squeezing it out in 3.5 years, your GPA is more likely to be under 3.0, which with a GPA under 3.0, means unlikely admittance into a grad program (at least without doing non-degree seeking credits you may not know would count for anything if they don't accept you into a grad program you want admittance to). Once again, you might be set on being a cop now, but a master's degree may be a boost to advancement or you may want another career later on.
It took me 5 years to get a BA. I went to school for a couple classes every summer. It took me 10 semesters. 6 semesters were 4 classes, 2 semesters were 5 classes, 2 semesters were 3 classes (but included 5 credit classes with labs for foreign language in semesters where I took 3 classes). Now I'm in a master's degree program for education and projected to graduate by May 2015 (I might be running it close, but it is worth the risk). So I decided to do 5 years instead of 4.5 for my BA and 2 years instead of 1.5 for my MA. I took a year off in between my AA and BA to save money working. So what should be 8 years for an MA with 1 year off in between that. Throughout college, I've worked about 15-20 hours a week steadily and lived at home with my parents and still do. I have a student loan of about $20,000-$25,000, at the moment, but have a decent amount in the bank from working and student loans too. I'm 24 and feel well positioned going forward.
Remember, you got your whole life to work. Whether you start at 22 or 24, when you are 44, you won't be thinking about those 2 years. However, although theoretically someone can go to college at any point in their life, life gets complicated as you get older (family members healthy problems, having kids, working lots of OT to save for a house) that make it impractical to go to school (unless you absolutely have a dire passion for education or are single your whole life). It is very easy to get anxious to want to get on the job (which happens with me a lot), but I do my best to remind myself that I will be wishing I was 24 again later on.
I hope this advice helped. Best of luck.
Last edited by nym01827; 05-04-14 at 02:58 PM.
More Research on Topic
I actually did a little more research since last posting. Based on those I've spoken to or stories I read from other threads on this site, regarding those who are in the current academy or scheduled for the upcoming January one, the timing seems to vary anywhere from 2 years 10 months to 3 years 4 months. Granted this projection can change either to sooner or later for us and other recent exams, but assuming the economy remains where it is or slightly better for the 3 years and many current police officers do retire, 3 years (or the July 2016 academy) seems like a realistic possibility. Possibly 3 1/2 years (or January 2017). No way of really knowing, but this projection seems likely.
When my friend took the exam in early '08 and got into the July '10 Academy, he actually was on the waiting list and was really lucky to get a spot. Most people who took his exam didn't get in until Jan '11. His wait was 2 years 4 months, but he scored very well on the test (high 90's counting city points). Most people who took his exam at the same time would have been 2 years 10 months. So at the very least, we know that most eligible people who exams between March '08 and March '11 waited a similar 3 years. A long wait, but if many people are willing to do the wait, it must mean it is a really good job to have.
Awesome advice nym01827, thanks for taking the time to answer my post. I definitely do plan on finishing school. I wanted to finish a semester early in case I did get called, just to play it safe. I think you're right though because I am at the bottom of 3319's list. I just received my list # 11xx out of 1179 eligible, so I'm all the way at the bottom. My friend, who is now a cop out where I live in Nassau County, NY was telling me I should be fine. He said he scored a 96 on the NYPD exam and his list # was even higher, so I guess not as many people take the test? I believe he took the exam in 06 or 04. Do you think I should re-take it? I do know of another person who scored around where I did and he said he was going through the process and his exam expired. I believe he took it in 08 or 09, so the economy could have been the reason why he didn't get hired. It's back and forth though. People tell me I'll get called and then others say my score is pretty low and with a high list # like that you may not get called in time. I guess I'll re-take the exam and hopefully I'll do better. Other than that there's really nothing I can do besides stay in school and out of trouble.
From what I've been told, if a person passes, there is no point in re-taking the exam because they'll automatically use your earlier date as your score. So long as a person who takes the exam passes, as far as I know, the date they took the exam matters more than test score. Whether it is 105 or 70. Even if the 70 was taken in a prior test cycle or 4 month fiscal cycle (not sure which of the two they use), they'll be ahead of that 100 taken several months after. So even if you took it now and got a 100, the 76 from June is better because your list number via an earlier exam is sooner to be called.
Originally Posted by thebest385
If you or I weren't to be called in a few years, which is highly unlikely, it would have to be for the same reason as anyone else. Which would have to be for circumstances that are not presently being anticipated (like really bad budget problems or if lots of cops who were expected to retire didn't retire). But still even than, we would still have list numbers that would eventually get called, but it would take longer. For example, Sanitation is allowing list numbers to remain active for 8 years after the exam date was taken. My friend who was offered the sanitation job earlier this year, but denied it, was on the list for 6 years. Right now I believe the NYPD list is good for 4 years deep. But if the expected wait were longer than that, they would probably extend that list. The logic behind the civil service system is first come first serve if a person meets the qualifications of the job.
If your other friend took the exam in '04 or '06 and got his list number called quick, the reason was he took the exam before the pay hike. Prior to 2008, NYPD police officers started at $26,000 and went up to $56,000 5 1/2 years in. After '08, they began starting at $44,000 and going up to $76,000 after 5 1/2 years. (All those numbers are base rates and actually higher when counting OT, night/day differential and other factors). Besides that, '08 was also the time when the economy really started tanking. We still haven't totally recovered from that. Prior to '08, the NYPD was generally viewed as low paying (unless you made rank), especially for rookies. Even School Safety, Special Officers, Motor Vehicle Operators and TEA agents start out at more now than NYPD did back than.
Since '08, the NYPD is viewed as good paying. Very good paying if a person doesn't have a college degree. Still pretty decent paying for a college grad. Cops virtually get paid the same as teachers, with similar benefits except summers and weekends off. But NYC public school teachers need an MA. NYPD cops only need 60 credits and it doesn't even have to be an AA. The job pays so well now that the percentage of people who take the test and job who aren't from the city, state or metropolitan area has risen a lot. Especially since the NYPD recruits in other states and on some military bases.
Although many cops and fireman believe they should get paid more, unless they have a highly valued degree or skill like nursing or accounting, they usually will not make more in the private sector. Most will come out making quite a bit less, likely no pension, possibly no union and less job security. And even if they were able to make a similar hourly wage doing a skilled union construction job, the work is back breaking, they go through points when work is slow and they don't get paid, no pension and they'll need to work till a later age. I've known of real estate agents who've made similar money to cops too, but you don't have the reassurance of a steady dollar amount on your paychecks. Think about it, the average cop starts at 26 and by 31-32, they can be making base $76,000, but more realistically $85,000-$90,000. I even know a lot of early-30's nurses, professors, accounts, financial analysts and engineers who make less than that. So the NYPD has really become a more desired job.
Regarding your friend who took the exam in '08 or '09 who didn't get called, do you know if he had the 60 credits within 1 or 2 years of taking the exam and do you know if he is a citizen? Do you know if he has a good driving record and good credit? Do you know if he has a clean criminal background? But those things likely get checked later on in the background investigation though). If the answer is yes to all that, I'm not sure why. I've known a couple people who've taken a city exam, relocated and never updated their address with DCAS. If DCAS mails someone's list # to a previous address and they do not know what the new address is and the person doesn't call up the automated DCAS phone #, how does the person receive their list #?
I don't know enough about how it all works and if the system was different 5 years ago, but I suppose it is possible his list number was never called. It would surprise me, but anything is possible. If you ever do have any concerns about how the system all works, DCAS would be the people you want to speak to regarding all that. They are really helpful. But you will most likely get the same responses I and many other members on Officer.com gave you.
Have you also considered becoming a Nassau Co. cop because I hear they get paid more? It is somewhat common for people who want to join the NYPD to also take Port Authority (although the commute may be long from Long Island and the test is not currently being offered and was only offered briefly this summer). Some take Corrections (similar wait to NYPD from what I've been told) and some take the test to become a court officer (not currently being offered and is a long wait from what I've been told). Remember too, with a bachelor's degree, you could go in as an officer in the military too. O1 second lieutenant is $32,000 to start, with no rent and virtually all expenses paid for. $32,000 with no expenses and no federal tax goes a lot further than $44,000 rookie NYPD pay. A college degree + military is a recommended pathway to Federal law enforcement. The idea is always to have a back up plan.
Like you said the only thing you can do at this point is wait, stay in school, do the right thing. Some people you will meet interpret "stay out of trouble" as stay out of jail. It goes well beyond that. It means don't get a ticket for going 25 MPH over the speed limit, it means never plagiarizing (this means always properly citing everything) and it means do not do drugs. I also recommend getting a credit card and making the full payment every month and developing good credit. No credit is not good credit. I doubt it would ever hurt someone in a job to have never had a credit line, but it could prevent getting a new car or mortgage. My first card that I got earlier this year was Capital One which I was immediately pre-approved for. A couple other banks I tried with like Chase denied me for not having prior credit.
It is very important as a police officer or any type of public servant to have very good moral character. Volunteering shows good character. Doing other public service jobs prior to getting on the force looks good too. Like substitute teaching, tutoring in schools, working as an aid for city summer programs like the housing authority, city hospitals or PAL. A lot of these summer jobs are available to college students. If you are looking for part time NYPD work, becoming a cadet is an option (but may require a criminal justice major and city residency, so I'd double check with that).
One other thing I could recommend is if you get a part time job you like, hold onto it for a while. If you've done the same part time job for like 2-3+ years, it shows you are reliable. It shows you don't quit when things get crappy. Also, if you get a job at a retail store like a Lowes, Home Depot or Pathmark that will give you a steady schedule (i.e. weekends only), it makes it a lot less stressful putting together a college semester every schedule. That was how I did it and it is what I still do in grad school. It helped me get into a similar rhythm of knowing when the best times of the week to study and write papers are.
Hey there, another 3319 here!
What are we up to people, when is our apd approximately?
I got my list number last month. Does a low list number speed up the process?
I dont think it speeds up. Based on what many people are saying here, if 500 passed and they need 100 at the time, they take 100 and the rest 400 wait for their time.
Only slightly. Only within tests taken in the month of June. It probably won't have an impact on receiving an APD any earlier. But it could make a difference in getting into an academy 2-3 years from now. What I mean by that is, let's say they only use part of the 3319 exam list for a particular academy. The numbers at the top of the list will come first. So it is possible part of our exam # goes into one academy as the last numbers put on, and then the rest get put in the following academy.
Originally Posted by AJenkins88
Hey Nym01827 are you with us on 3319 and are you in low or high list number? I read your post that you want to go for master's degree, anything else you're doing to prepare yourself?
Originally Posted by nym01827
Originally Posted by Al_nyc
Yes, I'm with you guys on 3319. I'm toward the middle of the list. I didn't get city points because I don't live in New York. I live in Florida. I'm originally form NY though. I'm currently going for my master's degree. I just completed my first semester yesterday. It was definitely a different animal than the undergrad. But doable with hard work and good time management. I'll be doing two more semesters of 4 classes per semester in spring and fall 2014, then an internship in spring '15. Then I will hopefully graduate in May 2015.
It is possible I will have a full year to teach before potentially being admitted into an academy. The master's degree I'm going for is in social science education. So I'm studying to become a social studies teacher (even though that isn't the primary career I'm aiming for). I'd like to either do this as a second career after a police career, or if I'm really lucky, perhaps a decade into my career, maybe become an instructor in the academy. Teaching in a prison might be interesting too.
I enjoy being in the classroom in terms of working with students. I really enjoy the material I work on. But I've never actually been a lead teacher yet so I'm not sure how I will like it once it happens. From what I can gather, I will like it. The part to teaching that is a bit frustrating is the amount of time needed to put in to design lessons well. There is much more science behind teaching than most people realize (or as we call pedagogy). It isn't the type of job you get away from. It is like you do more work out of the classroom than in it, between planning, grading, speaking to parents, ect. The work week is more like 50 hours a week, even though you only get paid 40. Although police officers can work more OT than they'd prefer at times, work is at work. You work within the hours of your shift. That type of structure is more what I'm used to.
There is an outside chance I'd consider becoming a professor too. But the money really isn't that great for the student loan debt you'd have to accrue so it isn't all that worth it. Plus even if you got a professor job, there is no guarantee of a job when you get out and all the stress and anxiety of getting tenure which may not come. Or it may require moving to the middle of no where to get a good job which doesn't appeal to me.
The way the NYPD is structured is much of the reason I want to join. It is very fair. Take the test, get your list number, wait you turn and the process comes around to everyone. No politics or favoritism. It isn't like that with most police departments or public servants throughout this country. In many other states, you actually need to pay for credits into a police academy for 6 months at a community college and possibly end up with no job when you get out. And the certification is only good for that state. Meanwhile, in New York, you get paid nearly the same as rookie salary while in the academy.
My list number on exam 3319 is 1xx. I'm wondering, when we'll get an investigator?
From what I've been told by others who've been hired in the past, the background investigation is one of the last steps to be done. I think only the mini-medical comes after. Which it makes sense that way because a person would have to pass their medical, written and oral psychological and JST before an investigator invests their time and resources into a candidate.
Originally Posted by KIRA
Nym01827 a good plan there, having a backup job is great. I think nypd should work out for you.
So the next step is receiving a letter in the mail for the Application Processing Documents? APD looks like a very detailed procedure, collecting all of the documents, etc. I heard they are processing candidates in 1300s pool now.
Another 3319 guy here. Just signed up, good luck to everyone out there. Just a quick questions does the NYPD accept FEMA credits toward the 60 requirement? I'm a little short and I work full time for DSNY, and out schedule is given to us daily so it's really hard to go back to school, I scored well on this test (even though I hear it doesn't much matter as far as the waiting game goes) and I just want to be prepared when the call does come. For Dsny my list number was 299x and I waited 6 years, on Nypd my list number is 1x , and I'm being told that still going to be another 2-3 years or more due to earlier exams. I have time but still would like to take care of the credits sooner than later.