Whats the difference between displaying and threatening with weapons

[CitizenX]

I've read case law from various states saying that simply displaying a firearm to deter someone from acting aggressively is not a threat. (Including situations where they make statements like "Don't even think about it"

Yet I know someone who was charged with both felony terroristic threats and simple assault for, after nearly being rammed by another driver who then leaned on the horn a few feet from his driver window, stuck a baseball bat out the car door and yelled "Quit honkin that horn or your gonna see how you like it!"

It's kind of hard to be respectful of the law when there is no clear line not to cross as to what is and what isn't illegal. Granted I probably would not have reacted this way, but it seems clear that the purpose of the law is not to intimidate everyone out of doing anything out of the ordinary but rather to stop people from doing certain things that are determined to be a danger to the public.

[BJJVad]

I severely doubt what you described, happened how you describe it.

The difference in a lot of cases is mindset and intent. There are laws that allow you to act immediately to protect yourself, and the lives of loved ones. Then there are laws that punish you for acting out of anger.

Think of the difference, and you will have your answer..

[PapaBear]

If I pull out my weapon, examine it, check the slide, look at the magazine, wipe everything down and put it away, that is displaying.

If I pull out my weapon, point it in your general direction, tell you not to do something and you fear I am going to shoot you, that is threatening!

What is so hard to figure out here?

If you fear the display of a weapon by another is an immediate threat to your safety, health or life that is threatening. It is not the intent of the victim but the fear of a victim of the actions that may result from another that determines how I would handle the incident.

[CitizenX]

@BJJ Vad

Im pretty sure thats what happened, I know this person really well. It was a girl driving the other car though, who did a 180 and played doe eyed innocent when the police got there. If he was going to lie about it why fess up to saying anything? I was recently in the car with him when another female rammed our car out of anger that he didn't let her back out. He didn't say anythign to the police because the lady was pregnant though, but she had plenty of time to react and pulled out at a wierd angle specifically aimed at his car.

The person said that people cut him off and honk at him in traffic all the time, and he couldn't care less. I ride with him frequently so I know this to be true. This was different and was really intense both because of the threat of the other car hitting him and the repeated horn use in close proximity to his window. His mindset was panic/fight or flight and his intention was to get the other person off his back.

In my state there is plenty of caselaw that says a conditional threat isn't a threat, because the other person isn't in danger unless they continue to do whatever the other person wants them to stop doing. I know that self defense isn't valid if you did or said anything to provoke the other person, but that only applies to situations where an actual fight occured.

So the only issue seems to be is the display of a weapon considered a threat?

[CitizenX]

@Papa Bear

Well I understand what you are saying from the point of view of a police officer, but then it seems like you would arrest people for something that wouldn't be against the law.

The cases I was talking about involved confrontations where people pulled up their coat to reveal a weapon or put it on the dashboard to get another person to stop yelling at them. Since firearms are far more deadly than other weapons, displaying them is really intimidating. Then there is the issue of conditional threats not being threats in my state, since the person isn't in danger unless they keep doing whatever the person wants them to stop doing.

It seems like pointing a gun at someone would be a threat, but then does it matter what you say? And with other weapons, what is the equivalent of "pointing"?

Specifically in the situation I described, did the person threaten or display the baseball bat?

[BJJVad]

I was recently in the car with him when another female rammed our car out of anger that he didn't let her back out...

......

[CitizenX]

Huh? Are you thinking she did it by accident? It wasn't, I was there. When she saw him coming, she jerked out farther and he pulled to the left side and stopped way before getting to the space. Then the person turns at an angle just lined up with his car, and backed up way farther then she would have needed to just to get out of the space. He also honked to alert her to his presence, and she continued to back up for several seconds after the honk to get to his car.

I only brought this up to show that the person had a recent experience that would not cause him to doubt that he might get hit by the other driver in the baseball bat situation.

[BJJVad]

..I only brought this up to show that the person had a recent experience that would not cause him to doubt that he might get hit by the other driver in the baseball bat situation.

....

[CitizenX]

I don't understand? Do you have a thought on the issue?

[BJJVad]

I don't understand? Do you have a thought on the issue?

Do you honestly want to hear it?

[CitizenX]

Sure, go ahead.

[Citicop]

In my state, if you purposely place another person in apprehension of immediate physical injury, you are guilty of assault third degree.

I would have PC to arrest the bat wielder based on your story.

-Citicop.

[BJJVad]

You and your buddy are morons..

Possession of a bat inside a vehicle tells me that your buddy is either, a) Daryl Strawberry or b) up to no good. Having a baseball bat located inside a cab tells me he generally, and frequently stashes it there for exactly such occasions.

Then you further post an incident to disprove his actions by posting an example that this guy is one of those **cks that can't let things go. Even if the lady had made a mistake during backing up, he is that exact type of a-hole that is going to park behind her and not purposely move in an attempt to insight an incident. Not to mention that in some area's it's a infraction or crime, to do such an act.

Had you or your buddy made any threatening remarks during the detention, she (the blocked in lady) could have had both of you locked up for false imprisonment.

Grow up DB..

[Samuel]

Where's Captain Obvious when you need him (to answer this profound question)?

[CitizenX]

In my state, if you purposely place another person in apprehension of immediate physical injury, you are guilty of assault third degree.

I would have PC to arrest the bat wielder based on your story.

-Citicop.

So basically what you are saying is that police just use the broadest interpretation of law, and do not consider any clarification of the law provided by case law etc. - even if it means the case will be thrown out eventually.

The law in my state says the same for assault, but you can't convict someone of it for giving the evil eye, or telling them to back off or else.

In the baseball bat situation, was the person threatening the other person, or the other person's car? If the other person was being threatened, how could he have gotten to that person while she was encased in 2000 lbs of metal and glass with the engine running?

It seems strange to me though because some laws are so vague that the broadest interpretation could include just about anything. Like aggressive driving or something. Almost no one gets convicted of aggressive driving, but if you make an officer angry they will charge you with it just to make your life miserable for a couple days.