Port Huron Police Shoot/Kill Woman

[darrell]

Here it is ladies and gents. I do not have anything further cause my contacts haven't called me as of yet.



Woman shot by police dies
Officers say she came at them with box cutter
By SHANNON MURPHY
Times Herald

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Neal Rossow







LOOKING BACK
Fatal Shootings


The last time a Port Huron police officer shot and killed someone was in July 1994 when officers Joseph Platzer Jr. and Edward Gerrow shot Conrad Walter Stevenson, 33. Police said Stevenson was on a porch at 10th and Howard streets and threatened the two officers with a gun, which turned out to be a toy. An investigation found the two officers acted properly. Now to the story.



A 43-year-old Port Huron woman died late Thursday after she was shot twice by a Port Huron police officer.

Police said Deborah Ann Kerr came at two officers with a box cutter about 11 p.m. on 25th Street near Nern Street.

One officer attempted to shock Kerr with a Taser, but police Capt. Neal Rossow said it is unclear if she was hit.

When Kerr continued to come at the officers, the other officer shot her in the chest and the arm, Rossow said. She died at Mercy Hospital in Port Huron a short time later.

The two officers, whose names are not being released by police, are on paid administrative leave while the department investigates. Rossow said the investigation should be done by next week.

"It's too bad the deploying of the Taser didn't stop her actions," Rossow said. "But the box cutter is a knife, and knives can hurt people."

Rossow said the same officers were called to the area about an hour earlier when Kerr was fighting with people in the neighborhood. Police persuaded her to leave. Shortly after the officers left, she came back and began destroying a window screen on a corner home, Rossow said. Kerr also was using the box cutter to cut her arms and legs.

Kerr had been at friend Deb Pomaville's home earlier in the day and then came back and began cutting the screen there. Pomaville said she has known Kerr for seven years and Kerr was not acting like herself when police came.

She said Kerr recently had suffered the loss of someone close to her.

"When she came to my door, she wasn't in her right mind," Pomaville said. "She cried hysterically, heartbreakingly, for four hours."

Kerr also recently had lost her job and was living with her sister in Carsonville, Pomaville said.

She said Kerr loved animals, especially her dogs -- Jess, who had to be put to sleep, and Lil' Bit, a Chihuahua.

"When she wasn't working, she spent time with her dogs, feeding squirrels or just talking to people," Pomaville said.

Kerr had a caring personality and was liked by many people, Pomaville said.

"She always wanted to help and give to people, especially ones in need," she said. "She was always giving away her stuff and money to others.

"She wasn't a selfish person, she just needed a lot of love and security."


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[P01IC3M4N]

"When she wasn't working, she spent time with her dogs, feeding squirrels or just talking to people," Pomaville said.

and probably to herself.

"She always wanted to help and give to people, especially ones in need," she said. "She was always giving away her stuff and money to others.

gee, a precursor to suicide?

"She wasn't a selfish person, she just needed a lot of love and security."

and apparently a good double tap to the chest.

[darrell]

I agree

[Switchback]

I tell you one thing, I hardly condone the use of a taser on a subject that is charging you with a lethal weapon. If she were jsut standing there, tase away! However, a charging subject poses way too high of a danger to use the taser! At least they had the lethal force on standby when deploying it.

[oscarmitre]

Question - how lethal can a box cutter (what I call a Stanley Knife) be? It is obviously a cutting implement as opposed to a stabbing implement.

[Norm357]

Question - how lethal can a box cutter (what I call a Stanley Knife) be? It is obviously a cutting implement as opposed to a stabbing implement.

That was the weapon of choice for the 9/11 hijackers Oscar. How many people died that day?

[coucousis]

Oscar are you implying that the use of force was excessive in this particular case.... ?

I'll give you my opinion on it:

If cutting the trachea.... probably very lethal...
If swipped in an eye.... may be not lethal but highly damaging...

It is lethal!!!! I would not take any chances either.... It's a job.... I'll never be paid enought to risk loosing an eye, my life or any injuries other then out of a good physical man to man confrontation.

I would still prefer the option of running away from the threath if it was possible considering if anybody else life would have been jeopardized .... But I was not there and can only assume that the officer did the execice the only option available to them!!!!

[coucousis]

That was the weapon of choice for the 9/11 hijackers Oscar. How many people died that day?

Good point Norm.... I did not think of it before.... Excellent tought!!! ;)

[Switchback]

Generally speaking, you'll often die from a slash much faster than a stab. Stabs take a lot more precision to be lethal quickly and they tend to be a litttle easier to treat on the scene. While stabs look good on TV, the slashes are much more productive. There are many, MANY easily accessible targets for slashes, i.e. tendons (disable limbs), numerous arteries that are close to the skin's surface, etc. These require less precision.

The best moves I know invlove simple slashes....multiple lethal cuts per series. I have seen plenty of lethal cuts from a 1.5" pocket knife... a stab would not get you far with that one.


FYI, I have had some knife fighting, as part of edged weapin defense training. I also have quite a bit of medic training medic training (military and civilian).

Also, when in a knife fight, the question is not IF you will be cut, but HOW MUCH. You come at me with anything resembling an edged weapon and you are getting some lead sent your way!

[oscarmitre]

Ah - now that makes sense. A person with a box cutter/Stanley Knife could use it to cut someone's throat if they were in the appropriate physical position. Yes that does make sense, that would be lethal and it would be easy to use because that is the way the knife is designed to work.

As for the hijackers, yes, box cutters allowed them to get control of the real weapons of choice.

P01IC3M4N - I found your comment very callous, I don't know if you meant it to sound that way but that's how I read it.

[Norm357]

Im diggin the Homer Simpson refrence in your sig Oscar! :D

[coucousis]

Ah - now that makes sense. A person with a box cutter/Stanley Knife could use it to cut someone's throat if they were in the appropriate physical position. Yes that does make sense, that would be lethal and it would be easy to use because that is the way the knife is designed to work.

As for the hijackers, yes, box cutters allowed them to get control of the real weapons of choice.

P01IC3M4N - I found your comment very callous, I don't know if you meant it to sound that way but that's how I read it.

Considering that any sharp weapon is dangerous within 21 feet... It's a long way .... That is what I learned at Police school that anyone coming at you within 21 feet was within the stabbing range. This considering that you have to react to the treath, take your handgun out of the holster, aim and shoot...
The only real safe distance is more then 21 feet. Anything closer then that is a mortal danger.

You have a point however.... if they were in the public street could they have back up and run a bit further.... ?I don't know... But I guess if they decided to shoot it is because no other safe options were available!!!

[txinvestigator1]

Question - how lethal can a box cutter (what I call a Stanley Knife) be? It is obviously a cutting implement as opposed to a stabbing implement.

It does NOT have to be lethal, only capable of causing serious bodily injury or death.

And to answer your question, I would be willing to slash away at you so you can make an informed decision.
;)

J/K

[Switchback]

Assuming I am close to you, you can give me a 1" blade and I can put 3 lethal cuts on you in less than a second... then we can talk lethality of any edged weapon!

[oscarmitre]

Norm - Homer is my guru - which explains a lot of things :D

Switch thanks for the info - that's what I was looking for.

No coucousis, fair question but I am not second-guessing the officers. I try to keep an open mind when something like this comes along. I actually find myself fighting a defensive reflex action (e.g. they must have had a good reason to shoot the woman) to keep that open mind. It might look like I'm trying to be a smart-arse but not.

In any case both you and Switch have indicated how dangerous this type of weapon is, those were points that I hadn't considered at all so I learned from those.