Downloading - disqualifying?

[esl550]

I was wondering if illegal downloading is a "disqualifier" during background checks, especially for agencies like ICE or the FBI. I don't anymore but I did download stuff in the past. Is it a big deal or is it one of those things to just be honest about on a polygraph?

EDIT: I ask because at a CIA job fair I was at recently the recruiter mentioned that they weren't too concerned about illegal downloading but that it would probably come up during background checks. I've kept my nose clean of drugs and that kind of stuff so this one jumped out at me.

[Kimble]

By "illegal downloading" I assume you mean downloading copyright material that you didn't pay for, as opposed to doing something else illegal online like downloading child pornography, is that what you meant?

Some departments make a big deal about any theft, online or otherwise, others do not. Hiring policies vary as much as the number of departments in the US, which is a lot. If asked about it on an application questionnaire be honest, but there's no one answer for all departments on this issue.

[esl550]

By "illegal downloading" I assume you mean downloading copyright material that you didn't pay for, as opposed to doing something else illegal online like downloading child pornography, is that what you meant?

The former(!). Yeah I meant music and such, especially music during high school.

[Wolfman]

As Kimble said. Just be honest on your application, you can't change what you have already done, but you can change what you do from this point forward. Since you know the rules now, don't download anything else illegally. If you get to the polygraph stage in the applicant process - when they ask you details about downloading, explain it to them and hope for the best.

Just don't lie about it. #1 rule on a Fed Job Application - if you lie they will DQ you or fire you later.

[JJRC]

I've never downloaded from the internet but is it okay to borrow a CD from someone and put the music on my computer? Otherwise all my music is paid for. I have a friend who also wants to go into law enforcement and she said that it was okay. But other people have said no.

[esl550]

I've never downloaded from the internet but is it okay to borrow a CD from someone and put the music on my computer? Otherwise all my music is paid for. I have a friend who also wants to go into law enforcement and she said that it was okay. But other people have said no.

Oh yeah, I would say with 99.99999% certainty that it's ok.
And to clarify, the difference is that the music on the CD has been purchased. All you're doing is copying legally purchased information. Downloaded music has never been purchased so it's like stealing.

[JJRC]

Thats a relief, thanks.

[pafindr]

No, you are infringing on copyright laws by copying music that someone else bought and putting it on your computer. It's the same as not paying for it.

If you don't own the CD you can't put it on your computer.
Look on the CD case and it'll say something like "All right reserved, Unauthorized duplication is a violation of applicable laws..."

[marinepilot]

Oh yeah, I would say with 99.99999% certainty that it's ok.
And to clarify, the difference is that the music on the CD has been purchased. All you're doing is copying legally purchased information. Downloaded music has never been purchased so it's like stealing.

No, you are infringing on copyright laws by copying music that someone else bought and putting it on your computer. It's the same as not paying for it.

If you don't own the CD you can't put it on your computer.
Look on the CD case and it'll say something like "All right reserved, Unauthorized duplication is a violation of applicable laws..."

pafindr is absolutely correct, and esl550 is absolutely incorrect!

Ever watch a DVD or VHS? esl550, by your reasoning, it would be perfectly okay for a friend who bought the VHS or DVD movie to loan it to me and I could copy it with no problems. But don't ALL movies have that big screen at the beginning that says something to the effect of Copying this is ILLEGAL?? Same for music, whether the disk has been purchased or not, if YOU did not purchase it, it is NOT okay for YOU to put it on YOUR computer.

It's called theft...

And besides, downloaded music usually HAS been purchased previously. How do you think it got on those download sites? Someone bought the CD and then ripped it into a sharing network.

[MikeG]

pafindr is absolutely correct, and esl550 is absolutely incorrect!

Ever watch a DVD or VHS? esl550, by your reasoning, it would be perfectly okay for a friend who bought the VHS or DVD movie to loan it to me and I could copy it with no problems. But don't ALL movies have that big screen at the beginning that says something to the effect of Copying this is ILLEGAL?? Same for music, whether the disk has been purchased or not, if YOU did not purchase it, it is NOT okay for YOU to put it on YOUR computer.

It's called theft...

And besides, downloaded music usually HAS been purchased previously. How do you think it got on those download sites? Someone bought the CD and then ripped it into a sharing network.

Food for thought:
I think we would agree that renting a movie and then copying it for future use would be theft.

But I record shows on HBO for viewing on my DVR at a later date. I can keep the shows long after the HBO license to show it has expired (nalogous to the rented movie being returned).

I believe the latter is only legal because the court rejected claims that it was theft. I can't articulate why the first instance is theft but the second instance is not although it's intuitive. Maybe the first instance wouldn't be theft? Dunno.

[esl550]

To be fair, the law is quite murky. For example: Is It Legal to Copy Music onto Your Computer? : NPR

There's this whole uproar about ripping music off removable media these days, and IMHO it's not something that can't be solved. Sony (I think it was Sony) tried using software a few years back that limited the amount of rips that could be done and they really got it handed to them. I don't think they're including that software in CDs anymore.
The thing with media-sharing these days is that too much of it is judicially murky. For example, it's now possible to copy music by recording internally off youtube music videos, which are posted legally by artist or company channels. I have yet to see an RIAA uproar over that method, but I consider it no different than P2P, torrents, etc.
Just more food for thought.

[marinepilot]

To be fair, the law is quite murky.

And I say make sure you mention that to the agencies you wish to work for, see how that works for you. You are the one that asked if it was illegal. If you already knew the answer, I'm just wondering why you asked in the first place?

[Kimble]

To be fair, the law is quite murky. For example: Is It Legal to Copy Music onto Your Computer? : NPR

Like marinepilot said agencies will tell you their opinion of the matter, regardless of whether yours is the same or not. The agency's opinion is what matters for whether you get a job with them or not.

[esl550]

And I say make sure you mention that to the agencies you wish to work for, see how that works for you. You are the one that asked if it was illegal. If you already knew the answer, I'm just wondering why you asked in the first place?

I was talking about P2P. Ripping music is different, which is what JJRC brought up.

[marinepilot]

I was talking about P2P. Ripping music is different, which is what JJRC brought up.

And what both pafindr and I have told you was also illegal. If you rip someone else's CD or movie into your computer, and you did not pay for it, then you are breaking the law. As I mentioned, it states right on the beginning of every movie I've watched in the past few decades that to copy the movie, even for your own use, is illegal and can be punished by law. Pafindr stated the same goes for music CDs, which have the warning printed on the label.

But, again, keep on pressing with that story. Come back and let us know how it goes for you.