Corrections officers can't get verified?

[Creeker]

I agree that BIG needs his own tag....based on his choices I think it should be somewhere along the lines of........Verified Federal Agent Guy!!! :D

I think if you do that, then cigarettes in England will want to be verified... :p

[cntryboy0531]

If I had a quarter, for everytime I encountered a CO who wanted to engage in a pissing match that they are LEO's, and "my job is more dangerous than yours", I'd have more money then Bill Gates. I don't doubt that they have a dangerous job, but for gods sake, everytime I deal with a CO, it's the same BULL**** time and time again.

I get to go to honor guard training in a few hours, and of course, one of the CO's on honor guard will start up with the "look what we have to deal with in the jails (display latest weapon created here)" I'm to the point I'm going to take my AR-15 out of the trunk with the 30 round mags and show them "Look what I deal with on the road, and I don't even know if I'll ever see the farking idiot pointing the thing at me before he blows my farking head off!!"

**end rant** :mad: :mad:

[Movementarian]

**end rant** :mad: :mad:

Seriously dude, come down off your cross. Law Enforcement Officer (LEO) does not only refer to police officers. It also refers to Federal Agents, correctional officers, probation officers, park rangers, and a host of other occupations that enforce the law.

You are just as bad as the CO that you talk about. Of course a CO is not a police officer, but he does enforce laws and aid in prosecutions by filing reports, writing statements, and testifying in the judicial process. Do you think that criminals stop committing crimes after they are arrested and confined in a jail or prison?

I get to go to honor guard training in a few hours, and of course, one of the CO's on honor guard will start up with the "look what we have to deal with in the jails (display latest weapon created here)" I'm to the point I'm going to take my AR-15 out of the trunk with the 30 round mags and show them "Look what I deal with on the road, and I don't even know if I'll ever see the farking idiot pointing the thing at me before he blows my farking head off!!"

Arguing about which job is more dangerous is just ridiculous. They are both highly dangerous occupations with their own dynamic. A PO could pull someone over that jumps out of their car and shoots him dead. A CO could turn the corner while walking his unit and have a homemade knife stabbed into his neck causing him to bleed to death. Which one is more dangerous? You are just as dead either way. Which one is more likely to happen? Who knows, but they both have happened at some point.

Correctional Officers are not Police Officers, whether or not they have some of the same off-duty powers or not. They are Law Enforcement Officers and deserve the same respect as any other brother in blue.

As to whether they should be given a "Verified LEO" tag, that is entirely up to RP. It is his site and his rules. Full stop.

One final note. cntryboy, I have nothing but respect for you and hope you don't perceive this a personal attack. I was attempting to respond in the same tone that you used for your post. I hope that everyone can agree with the principal of my argument. I whole-heartedly believe that elitism has no place in Law Enforcement and that no facet is more important than the other.

[Norm357]

I don't have a dog in this fight because I am nether a C/O nor a Police Officer.

However, IMveryHO C/Os are indeed LEO', thought not Police Officers.

[Hockey9019]

Just wondering....


What is the big deal about being verified? Is it for status? Just wondering...Is there something SO special on the other side??? Just curious


Here is what I assume the "Verified LEO" means


If you work for a police department and CAN enforce laws, on and sometimes depending on dept/state regulation off duty, then you are considered a LEO.


Corrections Officer? No. Deputy working in a jail? Yes.

Is it really that hard to comprehend?

Who cares whose job is more dangerous blah blah blah. Its a pissing match.


Unless you have the power to ENFORCE laws, then your a LEO. If your a C/O who is baby sitting prisoners, then you are not. If you are a C/O who HAS authroity to arrest, or enforce a LAW (Not policy) inside the prison, then you are a LEO. So, if you catch an inmate smoking pot, do you ARREST them? Exactly


Hey Norm, if you stay in a Holiday Inn last night, does that count :p :D


By the way...I really have no ground to stand on in what I wrote since I am not a C/O or LEO or whatever, but that is just purely my .02 ;)

[Norm357]

If your a C/O who is baby sitting prisoners,

That is a bull**** statement. C/Os do far more than babysit prisioners.

As for me, I like the verified tags because if I have a question for a police officer, then I know wether or not I am talking to one. I think a verified C/O tag would not be a bad idea.

[Hockey9019]

That is a bull**** statement. C/Os do far more than babysit prisioners.

Not at all, but there are some that do ;)


I know several and I wouldn't want their job for the life of me. Then there are some that just basically do that though...

I stand corrected...

[Movementarian]

Corrections Officer? No.

Why no on a Correctional Officer, but yes on A Jail Deputy? Correctional Officers (in fact, all employees that have regular contact with inmates) employed by the Federal Bureau of Prisons are Federal Law Enforcement Officers according the US Attorney General. They are covered under LEOSA, receive Special Base Rates for Law Enforcement Officers (not Law Enforcement Availability Pay (LEAP) as I previously stated), and have the 6c retirement plan. They also have arrest authority on and off duty.

So, if you catch an inmate smoking pot, do you ARREST them?

Yes you do. They are placed in handcuffs, searched (both their person and their living area), questioned, and placed in the Special Housing Unit (the jail inside of the prison). Evidence is collected, a report is compiled, and sent to the investigative authority. The case is investigated and then forwarded to the adjudicating authority and the inmate is tried and sentenced or sanctioned.

I don't know what the big deal about the tag is either. However people that work in confinement, regardless of their job title, are Law Enforcement Officers; they just don't get the tag on RP.

[Switchback]

...They are covered under LEOSA, receive Law Enforcement Availability Pay (LEAP)...

That is a HUGE NEGATIVE. They do NOT receive LEAP.

Why should a Deputy Sheriff who works in a jail be verified and not a CO?
Many Sheriff departments make no distinction between jail deputies and road deputies. They have the same training and same authority. In THIS instance, they can be verified.

Many Sheriff departments have separate positions for Jail Deputies and Road Deputies. They have less training and no (or very diminished) authority outside of the jail. These jail deputies are NOT eligible to be verified.

Sorry, if someone does not like it. That's the way it is. I am sure you can find a site where you can be verified as LEO (well, not really SURE )... you can always make your own forum. This is how RP is.

... I guess you could just vote me (and several others) off the island. :rolleyes:

[Movementarian]

That is a HUGE NEGATIVE. They do NOT receive LEAP.

You're right, I'm sorry. I confused LEAP with the Special Base Rates for Law Enforcement Officers, which is what BOP employees receive. LEAP is that thing for you criminal investigator types.

I agree that if RP doesn't want to give a CO the verified tag, that is his decision. In this forum, a "Verified LEO" is whatever RP says that it is. I agree that if someone doesn't like it they can go somewhere else. I disagree when people say that correctional workers are not Law Enforcement Officers.

[MP_Steve]

Opening the door to 'verify' just about everyone who may be 'Law Enforcement Officers' in their own right, would simply destroy the integrity of RP.

Nuff said.

[Creeker]

As for me, I know a lot of County C/O's who are simply thugs waiting to go thru booking... a lot higher percentage than I'd like... and my opinion of my state c/o's is worse...

I've known a few that were worth their salt, but they go thru a different process than LEO's. I think they are required to be more... "understanding" :mad:

[Hockey9019]

I made my statement off of Michigan Sheriff Departments. A LOT, (Not all) require you to start in the jails (but you are a Sheriff Deputy-not corrections deputy) and then move to the road. Like I said, not sure how it is outside of Michigan



Anywho...

[Joeyd6]

You're right, I'm sorry. I disagree when people say that correctional workers are not Law Enforcement Officers.

You can disagree all you want. The problem is your OPINION is not based on anything than that, an opinion. I would suggest you sign-up for an "Criminal Justice 101" class at any college and view the text used. It is very specific. It is also in the Department of Justice publication "Criminal Justice Terminology." Anyone who has studied the criminal justice system knows:

The Criminal Justice System is comprised of three elements:
1) Law Enforcement
2) Judicial Branch
3) Corrections

A CO's job is not to ENFORCE anything. It is to provide a safe environment and correct/rehab the individual to be ready to go back into society. And I will say it again and again, if there are guns, weapons or drugs inside a jail/prison, there are two people to blame:
1) Correction Officers
2) Administration at jail

Don't tell me "how dangerous" it is when they control the entire facility. When things are found, CO's are not doing the job (by their choice or administration). Either a CO brings it in, lets it in, or if prisoner made, CO's are not doing enough searching and controlling. That place is a controlled environment. What gets brought in is done in front of the CO's and administrators. As a cop we have holding cells at our precincts and offices. We control what goes in there too. If something ends up in there that should not be, it is our fault as officers for not doing our job.

You can think my idea is crap...but take a look at the well known jail where the inmates are left to wear pink and be treated like an inmate. The CO's and administrators run that place with more efficiency than anywhere else. No weapon problems, no drug problems, no fights, etc... Guys get out and there is a very low recidivism rate there. In essence the administration and CO's are doing their job. Don't take an administrators or CO's lack of doing their job (look at job descriptions in the vacancy announcement), which then creates a situation (lawless society in a confined area), which then then have to deal with, and call it "law enforcement.

[Movementarian]

That's nice.

The Criminal Justice System is comprised of three elements.

That is the basis of your OPINION as to why Correctional Officers are not Law Enforcement Officers? Here is what I based my OPINION on (at least BOP employees):

1. The U.S. Attorney General said so in his issuance concerning LEOSA,which was directed to the Directors of the ATF, BOP, FBI, USMS, the Administrator of DEA, and the Inspector General.
2. OPM says so in numerous reports to congress and by providing BOP employees the law enforcement base rate of pay and 6c retirement coverage.
3. Title 18 U.S.C. § 3050 (the section that defines BOP employee's, not just the Correctional Officers, arrest powers).

Your opinion is based on theory from a classroom, mine is based on practice and the opinions of people in power. I agree with the model of the criminal justice system, but no where in there does it say that there cannot be overlap. It does not say that personnel working for the courts or corrections are not Law Enforcement Officers. That is merely your interpretation. I would say it breaks down the criminal justice system from the offenders point of view: you are arrested (Law Enforcement), you are convicted (Courts), you serve your debt to society (Corrections).

Why are you turning this into a "who introduces contraband into a prison" debate? I am pretty sure that we can all agree that the largest contributor to the amount of contraband in prison is the staff, either by introducing it themselves or by not properly doing their job. There are also a whole host of dirty cops in prison and still on the streets, what's your point?

I never said how dangerous it was. I said that each job has it's own element of danger, which is true. You are referring to the way that Sheriff Joe Arpiao runs his jails. He runs an outstanding operation, but he is not running a prison. Everyone that comes through there has a time when they will be released from his custody, whether they served their sentence or are transferred to a prison. There are elements of what he does that could be applied to any correctional environment, but there are some dynamics that he doesn't have to deal with.

I know, and agree, that this has no bearing on the "Verified LEO" tag on this site. As I have said before, the only definition that matters here is RPs.