Would This Explain My Rejection/DQ?

[AspiringDeputy]

Back when I was 16 I was arrested along with two of my friends for some actions on the part of my friends (all I was doing was driving the car). I was charged, as were they, with a misdemeanor -aggravated menacing- due to comments made by my two passengers to a group of people on a sidewalk.

Ultimately all of the charges against me were dropped due to the fact that I hadn't done anything (aside from driving the car that they happened to be passengers in while they were acting up) and they figured out I hadn't done anything. The judge told me that there would never be a record of it, the incident didn't happen, and if anybody ever asked me about having been arrested, to answer "no" and aside from that he told me to exercise better judgement in who I associated with and who I chose as friends, and basically to go home and avoid trouble.

When the background investigator asked me the standard stuff he got to the question about arrests and what the judge told me was suddenly front and center in my mind. I had no idea if I should tell this guy something in contradiction to what the judge told me to do years ago (forget the whole thing, go on in life as though that day never happened, etc), or explain the entire thing. The judge said no record would ever exist anywhere and it occurred to me if I spoke about something and no record was around and he couldn't find anything, he might assume the worst, so I just kept my mouth shut because I didn't think it was important and the judge told me it didn't happen.

Well I recently received a letter telling me I was disqualified for unspecified reasons. As far as my background goes, I have no history of drug use (never even used marijuana), no history of driving issues (not even a speeding ticket or parking ticket), no credit issues, no employment problems, nothing along those lines. Is it likely that he found that one arrest and decided I had failed to disclose it or concealed it?


I had passed the polygraph and figured I would pass the background investigation as well, I wasn't trying to be deceitful or anything, the judge told me no record would ever exist and to live my life as though the arrest had never happened. I wasn't sure if talking about the incident would complicate things or not.


I'm applying to a few other places and I figure it's best to make mention of the arrest and let them decide if it matters or not.

Is it a safe assumption that the issue for my rejection was that they found that record and they decided to wash me out for failing to disclose that? They didn't give me any explicit reason, they just said I wasn't selected and am not eligible to apply again.


Thank you in advance for any answers, advice, etc, that you might give.

[pac201]

Sounds like you were DQ'd for not listing the arrest. You were arrested and later the charges were dismissed by a judge.

Any other job besides law enforcement and what the judge said would be okay, as you have found, in LE those pesky background investigators can find out pretty much anything...

Good luck, remember to list it and explain it when asked.

[retdetsgt]

pac201 is probably right if there is nothing else bad in your background. It's much better to list something and let them learn that it turned out to be nothing rather than the other way around.

[mcsap]

A couple of speeding tickets wont DQ you.

Lying about them WILL.

Lesson learned.

[AspiringDeputy]

When applying elsewhere do I state I was DQed/rejected or "non-selected" since I received a letter from one place stating that my application was "denied", but they didn't use the word disqualified or rejected and they didn't tell me what the issue was.

The other place sent me a letter informing me that "you have not been selected."


Obviously I have to mention that arrest from now on, and I plan to, but how I do deal with the rejection issues, state them as DQ/rejections or as "non-selections" and then elaborate further if asked?

[marinepilot]

When applying elsewhere do I state I was DQed/rejected or "non-selected" since I received a letter from one place stating that my application was "denied", but they didn't use the word disqualified or rejected and they didn't tell me what the issue was.

The other place sent me a letter informing me that "you have not been selected."


Obviously I have to mention that arrest from now on, and I plan to, but how I do deal with the rejection issues, state them as DQ/rejections or as "non-selections" and then elaborate further if asked?

When applying to new agencies they are going to want to know the status of applications you have completed with other agencies. It's best to use the language you were told by that agency when they informed you of whatever the status was. For the one, you state your application was denied, so I would put that as a status for that application. If you know why, let the agency you're applying to know if there's a spot for it. In another case you were told "you have not been selected," so that would be the status of that application. Again, if you know why, tell them. As you apply to more agencies, you may even put that another application has been submitted. The truth is always the best.

[Kimble]

When applying elsewhere do I state I was DQed/rejected or "non-selected" since I received a letter from one place stating that my application was "denied", but they didn't use the word disqualified or rejected and they didn't tell me what the issue was.

The other place sent me a letter informing me that "you have not been selected."


Obviously I have to mention that arrest from now on, and I plan to, but how I do deal with the rejection issues, state them as DQ/rejections or as "non-selections" and then elaborate further if asked?

It should be fairly obvious by now that full disclosure is required if you want a shot. As an applicant for a police position you don't have the luxury of only telling what you want to or picking and choosing what background information you will share, not if you want to be hired. Anything less (like leaving out arrests or not mentioning you were DQ'ed with another agency if asked) is again going to be a guaranteed fast-track of your application in the list of "non-selection" letter recipients.

[coppers1]

I'm guessing that even if he had an adult arrest it would have been no big deal if the charges were dismissed.

[Kimble]

I'm guessing that even if he had an adult arrest it would have been no big deal if the charges were dismissed.

No arrest of any sort would be seen as "no big deal." Arrests are serious consequences of misconduct. However, whether the arrest permanently DQ an applicant would depend on the type of arrest (i.e. the severity of the crime) and when it occurred. Also, the fact it occurred when the person was an adult (and should be old enough to know better to do whatever they did to be arrested) is also likely going to play against them even more. Charges being dismissed in itself doesn't magically make everything okay, some charges are dismissed due to lack of evidence or because a prosecutor doesn't want to try to case, not because the arrestee wasn't guilty of the offense he/she was charged with.

Long story short, you guessed wrong. An arrest of any sort is a big deal, whether it can be overcome for someone wanting to be a cop depends on the seriousness of the crime and the length of time since the arrest.

[Citicop]

I'm guessing that even if he had an adult arrest it would have been no big deal if the charges were dismissed.

Clearly.



The devil will be in the details here. What was the charge, what actually happened, why were the charges dismissed, and other information will all be important in determining what (if any) effect the arrest would have on an application.

-Citicop.

[AspiringDeputy]

No arrest of any sort would be seen as "no big deal." Arrests are serious consequences of misconduct. However, whether the arrest permanently DQ an applicant would depend on the type of arrest (i.e. the severity of the crime) and when it occurred. Also, the fact it occurred when the person was an adult (and should be old enough to know better to do whatever they did to be arrested) is also likely going to play against them even more. Charges being dismissed in itself doesn't magically make everything okay, some charges are dismissed due to lack of evidence or because a prosecutor doesn't want to try to case, not because the arrestee wasn't guilty of the offense he/she was charged with.

Long story short, you guessed wrong. An arrest of any sort is a big deal, whether it can be overcome for someone wanting to be a cop depends on the seriousness of the crime and the length of time since the arrest.

Basically what happened was that I was driving a car (in a mall parking lot) with two of my friends as passengers. We were parked alongside a sidewalk area and some folks who thought they recognized one of my friends came up to start trying to talk to him, we tried to bum some cigarettes off of them, one of them made some remark or something to one of my friends and flashed a knife saying something along the lines of "you looking to get cut" at which time my friend in the front passenger seat flashed a 6-7 inch combat knife (which belonged to me) that he had tucked up against his body and said something along the lines of "mine's bigger" my friend in the back ran his mouth at one of the girls in the group, something about "what's a ho' like you doing out here, looking to get raped?", and about that time I threw the car into drive and got out of there, at the very least annoyed that such a verbal exchange had taken place, if I recall I scolded him and said, "don't use that word when talking to a girl, sheesh you want to freak her out and get us all pinched?"

We were arrested about 4-7 minutes later just a few miles down the road. There were about 4-5 squad cars involved, I was told to throw the keys out the window with my left hand, unbuckle my seat-belt with my left hand, and then exit the vehicle and walk backwards. Of course I complied and was arrested although at that point my main concern was what was going to happen to the car since it was my dad's car and I didn't want it to get towed. I asked if they would just lock the car up and leave it in the parking lot I had pulled into, when I saw the flashing lights, so that my dad (who only lived a few miles away), could come and pick it up, the request was denied and the vehicle was towed.

They actually brought the girl my friend had mouthed off at to the scene and had her ID my friend as the one who had used the word "rape" while mouthing off to her. Well surprise surprise, she didn't think it was as funny as my friend probably thought it was when he had it in his head.

I don't know what my friends put in their statements, but I was told by the officer who was talking to me at the station, "somebody is lying here because your friends' statements don't match each other, they're each telling something radically different from what you're saying, and they're also telling stuff different from each other."

I was the only one of us who honestly stated what was going on. When asked why we were at the mall I put in my statement, "we were looking for people from school that we could freak out by shouting obscenities and honking the horn at them, maybe throw junk at them, stuff like that" (yeah immature and stupid I know). I gave a play by play account of what happened, and it was the truth. To this day I have no idea what my friends claimed had transpired but their stories didn't match mine and they each told a different lie from each other.

I do know that my one friend who made the "rape" statement claimed that he was just singing a rap song and had spontaneously broken into song at the time he made the remark. I spoke with him afterwards (after our arrest and release) and basically said, "What a really great time to spontaneously break into song and use that word, don't you think?"

I think my other friend had some sort of amnesia issue because from what I gather, he couldn't remember why we were at the mall or in the mall parking lot. Whatever he said it was a lie since it didn't match what I said and I was overwhelmingly honest, I didn't pull any punches about the fact we were out clowning around looking to pester guys from school that we didn't like.

My role in the incident is that I was driving the car when my friends ran their mouths and that was the extent of my involvement. Of course at the time if I had seen somebody from school I didn't like I'd have thrown junk at them, honked the horn, and laughed at them. But not in a thousand years would I have flashed a knife at somebody or run my mouth like either of my friends.


Fast-forward a while and the judge met with me (my father was also present), he congratulated me for being an honor's student and doing so well in high school, he talked to my dad about me, he said it appeared I had never had any issues with the law before (indeed that was the case), he talked to me about my friends and said that they both had rather extensive records (this was unknown to me at the time), told me that all the charges against me were being dropped, and that I should forget about the entire thing, go home, stay out of trouble, and pick new friends.

It turned out my friends had issues along the lines of vandalism, breaking and entering, etc. At one point they had done around $25,000 dollars in damage to a home that they vandalized while the owner was on vacation. I had never known about any of that sort of behavior on their part.

I knew them from childhood, lost contact with one of them after early grade school (met back with him at high school) and the other one I knew for the most part from the middle of grade school on into high school, and then started hanging out with them on a regular basis around age 15.5 to 16. After the arrest incident I pretty much distanced myself from them and was no longer associating with them except to say hello or sit near them at lunch occasionally.

We'd been clowning around pretty much all of that week, throwing handfuls of dog food, rubber erasers, etc, at kids from school who we didn't like (mostly the punk type kids with the weird haircuts), and I just got caught up in hanging out with my friends and was clearly clowning around way too much.

I guess since my statement matched what they were able to figure out and what the folks who called the police had to say, they figured I was telling the truth (which I was), and since my record was squeaky clean at that time (which it was), they determined I wasn't in the same category as my friends were and I was allowed to get back to life without having any nasty interruptions. Due to their various priors both of my friends had to do X days in juvie, to be served on the weekends while school remained in session and then the remainder during that summer.

[mcsap]

A person could have committed an internal theft at their job with the employer choosing to just fire them and not involve the police but it is still a THEFT.

So even with no police report or arrest , such an offense would still have an impact. Much less an arrest that was later dropped, dismissed or reduced.

We look at the type of person that you actually are , not just what you got away with.

[AspiringDeputy]

A person could have committed an internal theft at their job with the employer choosing to just fire them and not involve the police but it is still a THEFT.

So even with no police report or arrest , such an offense would still have an impact. Much less an arrest that was later dropped, dismissed or reduced.

We look at the type of person that you actually are , not just what you got away with.

I've never been asked to resign from a job and I've never been fired from a job, and I've never stolen anything, period. That surprised them when they asked me about stealing even small things such as a pack of gum as a kid, or taking a bunch of pens from work. I never took anything from work that I was not instructed/authorized to take. One day a shipment arrived in error and the company that sent the extra box in error flatly stated that they would not spend the time/resources to sort out the issue (it was a box of stuff worth perhaps 90-100 dollars at most), so the manager/boss of the office gave every employee that wanted some of the stuff from the box, a handful of stuff.

As for the polygraph, I passed the polygraph and they asked questions about theft and work history. I was routinely trusted with money (for purchases, getting change, etc) at one of my jobs (which I had for three years) and not a penny ever went missing on my watch, everything was accounted for.

I had one job for three years and my boss told me I was one of the best if not the best employee he had ever had. Probably because I was always available to work on short notice (if they called me and said "we need you here today, can you be here in an hour?" unless I was in class I was there), I always did every assignment/task assigned to me, and I made it a point to do things that I saw needed to be done without having to be told to do them.

The only thing negative an employer might ever say about me is that I can be somewhat opinionated, although not to the point of getting into arguments with co-workers and hindering the working environment.

In about six years I've had four jobs, two were while I was in college taking classes, one was a part-time summer job when classes were not in session, and one was a job briefly after graduation.


A background investigator could search for a year and talk to everybody I've ever interacted with and nobody would be able to honestly say I am a thief. I've never stolen anything, not a single dollar, not a pack of gum, not a candy bar, period.

[marinepilot]

I've never been asked to resign from a job and I've never been fired from a job, and I've never stolen anything, period.

I've never stolen anything, not a single dollar, not a pack of gum, not a candy bar, period.

And he isn't accusing you of being a thief. He was using it as an example of the fact that crimes, whether detected or not, are a big deal. Especially if there was an arrest made, even if the charges were later dropped, dismissed, or reduced.

As for me, I would tell you to think about what you're saying. You say you were arrested for what your friends did, and you were squeaky clean and did no wrong. Yet, in the eyes of the law, you were found WITH those friends, in a car under YOUR control, and you had not DONE ANYTHING to stop the crime (telling your friend that wasn't a good idea doesn't count in the eyes of the law). It's time to accept that you were charged for a crime, the charges were dropped, and you went on with life.

[AspiringDeputy]

And he isn't accusing you of being a thief. He was using it as an example of the fact that crimes, whether detected or not, are a big deal. Especially if there was an arrest made, even if the charges were later dropped, dismissed, or reduced.

As for me, I would tell you to think about what you're saying. You say you were arrested for what your friends did, and you were squeaky clean and did no wrong. Yet, in the eyes of the law, you were found WITH those friends, in a car under YOUR control, and you had not DONE ANYTHING to stop the crime (telling your friend that wasn't a good idea doesn't count in the eyes of the law). It's time to accept that you were charged for a crime, the charges were dropped, and you went on with life.

I know he wasn't accusing me, he was just mentioning the possibility of what they might find when talking to employers and such. I'm just saying in my case there is nothing to find in the way of theft because I've never done that, so that couldn't possibly be a DQ issue in my case.

Okay, so what does a juvenile arrest for a misdemeanor with the charges ultimately dropped count for? It shouldn't be an issue as long as I disclose it and give all of the details when asked, right?

If you were doing a background investigation and somebody said "yeah I was arrested at 16, it was pretty stupid, I was foolish, hanging out with some of my trouble making friends, the charges were dropped, nothing ever came of it, and that was the only arrest of my life" would it count that much in your opinion? The key is to disclose and give the details when asked, right?

Thanks for taking the time to reply thus far.