Question about becoming a detective

[flea77]

Hi. I have a couple of questions and I will try and keep this brief but honest.

I have really been considering become a detective over the past few years. I will be perfectly honest and say this is probably because I grew up really facinated by shows like Law & Order. I understand the television show is obviously overly, overly dramatized and don't picture the job anything like that...

My educational background is fairly good so far. I graduated with a 3.8 GPA with my B.S. in Mathematics and am currently working on my M.S. in Computer Science which I will have completed next spring. One of my job prospects coming out with my bachelors (and the only one that interested me) was working with the NSA or CIA in the area of cryptanalysis. They hire people with just bachelors degrees and apparently, you become a detective somehow.

I am quite confused by this entire process. I am not sure what the difference between this sort of detecitve and a police detective is. I am strongly planning to either possibly work for the CIA or NSA after masters, or continue on with phd and look at my possibilities after that

But I really want to be a detective. I think mathematics has given me strong logic skills. So do these sort of detectives (CIA, NSA hired ones) work with police? Are they considered police? I thought that to be a detective you had to be a police officer for some years?

I am terribly confused and looking for advice

The other thing is that I am a Muslim woman who wears hijab. The NSA recruiters didn't seem to have a problem with this, but I am worried if that will cause me problems in becomming a detective. I am born in US and am US citizen.

Thanks for any advice

[GoDirectly2Jail]

With aspirations for the CIA or NSA, I'd have thought your ability to search the forums to see if your question have been asked earlier would be more advanced than it is.

Articles, such as the sticky AT THE TOP OF THIS VERY FORUM about the differences in Federal, State, and Local LEOs for instance:

http://forums.realpolice.net/vbjourn...le&articleid=3

That is putting aside for the moment your claim to be US born and bred with written sentence structure such as, "I am born in US and am US citizen," unless the majority of your life has been spent outside of the US.

Next, 'detective' is a title, not a position, and as a title, it is usually found only at the state/local level, not at the feds. But even if it were, the NSA and the CIA do not employ 'detectives' that do cryptanalysis. That type of work is usually performed by an analyst, not an investigator.

Lastly, your religious beliefs have no bearing one way or another.

Hope that helps.

[flea77]

With aspirations for the CIA or NSA, I'd have thought your ability to search the forums to see if your question have been asked earlier.

I'm sorry I didn't look through the top.. Perhaps I should have phrased my questions better. I am just generally interested in the process of becoming a detective and curious in what kind of work is done. Cryptanalysis is just the thing which had stuck out in my mind. Every time the recruiters spoke with me they just talked about becomming a detective which I'm interested in. I didn't really know there was a difference, analysts and detectives that is. I have only briefly spoken with the recruiters. But I know they were very intersted as they apparently like to have mathematicians on board.

That is putting aside for the moment your claim to be US born and bred with sentence structure such as, "I am born in US and am US citizen," unless the majority of your life has been spent outside of the US.

Umm... I am American, as are my parents. I've lived here my entire life and I converted to Islam about 2 years ago. Sorry for my terrible grammar? I didn't major in English... :/ Most of my close friends and my boyfriend are from India so I'm just used to phrasing sentences like this at times. It has rubbed off on me, leaving "a" out here and there and just saying US instead of the US or however else you would I guess...

thanks for the help...

[Citicop]

There are many Federal Agencies who hire people with degrees to become investigators.

Among these are the DEA, FBI, ATF, Secret Service, and ICE.

The CIA and NSA are not Law Enforcement Agencies. They work in intelligence, which is related to, but different from Law Enforcement. Consequently, there are no investigative or "detective" positions at those agencies, though they have analysts to go over the intel.

The other option you would have is to apply at a local or state agency, learn Law Enforcement from the patrol position (a very good way to do it) and then put in for a spot as a detective when one becomes open after you have been on 3-5 years (the minimum time necessary for promotion or transfer).

Note that there are uniform requirements for many of these agencies, and I am unfamiliar with any Federal, State, or Local Agencies that employ a sworn officer or investigator with those garment requirements.

There will be several Federal Agents along soon, I am sure, who will be able to shed more light on this at the Federal Level, with which I am not as familiar.

-Citicop.

[GoDirectly2Jail]

Umm... I am American, as are my parents. I've lived here my entire life and I converted to Islam about 2 years ago. Sorry for my terrible grammar? I didn't major in English... :/ Most of my close friends and my boyfriend are from India so I'm just used to phrasing sentences like this at times. It has rubbed off on me, leaving "a" out here and there and just saying US instead of the US or however else you would I guess...

thanks for the help...

My comment was not meant to be a slam on you, but when seeking employment, you must realize you will be critiqued on your communications skills. My own department collects a writing sample from every interviewed applicant. Don't sell yourself short by using poor grammar. Practice now so it becomes second nature.

[BP348]

The other thing is that I am a Muslim woman who wears hijab. The NSA recruiters didn't seem to have a problem with this, but I am worried if that will cause me problems in becomming a detective. I am born in US and am US citizen.

Of course they don't have a problem with it! federal law states that they can't have a problem with it.

I'm going to throw up a big BS flag here.

People who were born here don't write and/or speak like "I am born in US and am US citizen". Just dosen't happen and having friends from India wouldn't make you write and/or speak like that.

Finally I agree with everyone else. There is no detective position at either NSA or the CIA. Want to be a detective? Apply at a department do your time in patrol and earn it.

P.S. Don't beleive everything you see on TV!! It's not really like that.

[Samuel]

I have a problem with people who want to be part of a team but feel the need to be individuals first (e.g. voluntarily/knowingly joining an agency that has dress code standards and raising a big stink - suing - to be allowed to be different - dress different, act different, be exempted from policy(ies) that everyone else has to follow, etc).

[Joeyd6]

Sam, bravo for stepping out from behind the PC curtain. If the original post lacked two specific details, this thread would have had so many "PC" posts. I share your point. I don't care what gender any person. But they sure better be able to do the same job as me. We have had that discussion before on Real Police about male vs. female standards and we all agree, gender and size don't matter, its not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of fight in the dog. I don't see flea77 having any problems because she is a woman.

But there are issues here. You are more concerned about a title of what you want to do rather than what you are actually doing. You need to realize titles come and go, but the work remains. If you are taking the job for the title, you be in for a rude awakening. Additionally, the CIA and NSA are not law enforcement agencies. They are intelligence agencies. And it sounds like based upon your education that you would be a great fit at either agency, providing valuable

If you are thinking about actual law enforcement, you need to understand four things in my opinion. First, nobody becomes a detective with a police department. You have to first get hired, attend a police academy, graduate a police academy, and work patrol for several years. Then you may have an opportunity to apply or be selected as a detective. There are more who want that job than there are positions.

Second, your hijab would be an issue. It is a personal choice and not religiously required. (I am not going debate it as Muslim scholars have done such and the Qur'an itself only says to dress with "modesty" and make sure your "bussom is covered.") It is a safety issue for many reasons.

Third, if you did not plan on working during Jumu'ah, you may have issues. Roman Catholics do not get every sabbath off, Jewish officers do not get every Shabbatt off and the Buddhist do not get every Uposatha off. Public service agencies are there to provide a service to the public 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. That does not stop because it is a sabbath day. Many Roman Catholics have to work Christmas/Easter, many Jews work Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur. While they can try to occasionally accommodate you, realize this line of work is 24/7, and the needs of the public and agency outweigh your personal needs and you will have to work religious holidays.

Third, be ready to answer questions. Many American hold a grudge or negative opinion or bias against Muslims. They may not want to admit it publicly or on an internet forum, but it is there. Law enforcement is on the front line of the fight against domestic terrorism and you will have to explain the difference between Muslims and radical Muslims to your co-workers. You will probably be asked your point of view and expected to discuss such. That is your chance to explain yourself, denounce the radical Muslim views, and show your co-workers you care just as much. Educate them.

Good luck with your career. You sound like you will do fine after you pick if you want to do traditional law enforcement work or intelligence work.

[flea77]

Thanks for all the advice.

I didn't mean to put a wrong image of me forward. I am not just after a title, I am simply after a position where I can use the mathematical logic I have worked hard to master in a useful way. That's why I was just kind of curious what exactly a detective does. I want to be able to help in the process of justice, and the only way I know to contribute is with my mind... so I was just curious about this kind of position. I don't care what the position is called.

One last thing... for whoever threw up their "BS" flag... yes I am absolutely American. Whats the point of lying about it on an internet forum??? And aparently you haven't had as many international friends surrounding you to think that it doesn't effect your speech without thinking... I am around Indians all day and night. My bf, all my closest friends, and the people who I work with all are. I rarely speak with Americans these days and its common for INdians to say "I'm in US." I don't know anyone would say "I'm in THE US." Wow! Didn't realize this was such a big deal... to the guy who said you just wanted to point out about grammar... thanks and I do appreciate that

The reason I asked about being a Muslim is just because I'm curious about how "friendly" the environnment would be, as I have had some really really bad experiences with law enforcement at least where I live. BUt that is not saying much as the place I live is a fairly racist place... and the cops are 100% better than the citizens around here... but even so I've just been treated kind of poorly here and there and was wondering if this is an area of work where a Muslim person won't be too accepted

[retdetsgt]

The reason I asked about being a Muslim is just because I'm curious about how "friendly" the environnment would be, as I have had some really really bad experiences with law enforcement at least where I live. BUt that is not saying much as the place I live is a fairly racist place... and the cops are 100% better than the citizens around here... but even so I've just been treated kind of poorly here and there and was wondering if this is an area of work where a Muslim person won't be too accepted

If you try to blend into the community of law enforcement, your religion won't be a problem. We are pretty good at judging people on their worth.

In dealing with colleagues at work, if you look at yourself first as a cop, there will be no issues. If you flaunt your gender and religion, you will be shunned. Not because of your gender or religion, but because you choose to separate yourself from everyone else. We are a close knit community and we don't identify ourselves as white cops, black cops, Muslim cops, Christian cops, etc. At the end of the day, we are all one, but if you hold yourself apart as a Muslim woman cop, you won't be accepted.

[flea77]

If you try to blend into the community of law enforcement, your religion won't be a problem. We are pretty good at judging people on their worth.

In dealing with colleagues at work, if you look at yourself first as a cop, there will be no issues. If you flaunt your gender and religion, you will be shunned. Not because of your gender or religion, but because you choose to separate yourself from everyone else. We are a close knit community and we don't identify ourselves as white cops, black cops, Muslim cops, Christian cops, etc. At the end of the day, we are all one, but if you hold yourself apart as a Muslim woman cop, you won't be accepted.

Thank you, I completely understand what you are saying!! :D I am not that type of person