Calling all California Law Enforcement Officers

[DKMYHEART]

Hello All.

I did a search and didn't find anything on this subject, I hope this isn't a repost. Thank You all for your service and any help you can offer.

My problem is in understanding the California Provisional Drivers License. I am a P.E.O. in L.A. County. I have asked Many Deputies & the D.M.V. this question and have a mix of yes & no answers. There is no consensus on this matter. Here it goes.

I leave for work at 05:30 and my Husband is disabled and bedridden. My Son Just got his provisional license. He & his Sister currently walk a couple of miles to school every day with 40 to 60# backpacks, there are no school buses available. Can He take his Sister to & from school under one of the exceptions to the Provisional Law I've highlighted in red below.

Thank You. T.H.

**************

Provisional License for Minors: Distinctive Driver’s License

12814.6. (a) Except as provided in Section 12814.7, a driver's license issued to a person at least 16 years of age but under 18 years of age shall be issued pursuant to the provisional licensing program contained in this section. The program shall consist of all of the following components:

(1) Upon application for an original license, the applicant shall be issued an instruction permit pursuant to Section 12509. A person who has in his or her immediate possession a valid permit issued pursuant to Section 12509 may operate a motor vehicle, other than a motorcycle or motorized bicycle, only when the person is either taking the driver training instruction referred to in paragraph (3) or practicing that instruction, provided the person is accompanied by, and is under the immediate supervision of, a California licensed driver 25 years of age or older whose driving privilege is not on probation. The age requirement of this paragraph does not apply if the licensed driver is the parent, spouse, or guardian of the permitholder or is a licensed or certified driving instructor.

(2) The person shall hold an instruction permit for not less than six months prior to applying for a provisional driver's license.

(3) The person shall have complied with one of the following:

(A) Satisfactory completion of approved courses in automobile driver education and driver training maintained pursuant to provisions of the Education Code in any secondary school of California, or equivalent instruction in a secondary school of another state.

(B) Satisfactory completion of an integrated driver education and training program that is approved by the department and conducted by a driving instructor licensed under Chapter 1 (commencing with Section 11100) of Division 5. The program shall utilize segmented modules, whereby a portion of the educational instruction is provided by, and then reinforced through, specific behind-the-wheel training before moving to the next phase of driver education and training. The program shall contain a minimum of 30 hours of classroom instruction and six hours of behind-the-wheel training.

(C) Satisfactory completion of six hours or more of behind-the-wheel instruction by a driving school or an independent driving instructor licensed under Chapter 1 (commencing with Section 11100) of Division 5 and either an accredited course in automobile driver education in any secondary school of California pursuant to provisions of the Education Code or satisfactory completion of equivalent professional instruction acceptable to the department. To be acceptable to the department, the professional instruction shall meet minimum standards to be prescribed by the department, and the standards shall be at least equal to the requirements for driver education and driver training contained in the rules and regulations adopted by the State Board of Education pursuant to the Education Code. A person who has complied with this subdivision shall not be required by the governing board of a school district to comply with subparagraph (A) in order to graduate from high school.

(D) Except as provided under subparagraph (B), a student may not take driver training instruction, unless he or she has successfully completed driver education.

(4) The person shall complete 50 hours of supervised driving practice prior to the issuance of a provisional license, which is in addition to any other driver training instruction required by law. Not less than 10 of the required practice hours shall include driving during darkness, as defined in Section 280. Upon application for a provisional license, the person shall submit to the department the certification of a parent, spouse, guardian, or licensed or certified driving instructor that the applicant has completed the required amount of driving practice and is prepared to take the department's driving test. A person without a parent, spouse, guardian, or who is an emancipated minor, may have a licensed driver 25 years of age or older or a licensed or certified driving instructor complete the certification. This requirement does not apply to motorcycle practice.

(5) The person shall successfully complete an examination required by the department. Before retaking a test, the person shall wait for not less than one week after failure of the written test and for not less than two weeks after failure of the driving test.

(b) Except as provided in Section 12814.7, the provisional driver's license shall be subject to all of the following restrictions:

(1) Except as specified in paragraph (2), during the first 12 months after issuance of a provisional license the licensee may not do any of the following unless accompanied and supervised by a licensed driver who is the licensee’s parent or guardian, a licensed driver who is 25 years of age or older, or a licensed or certified driving instructor:

(A) Drive between the hours of 11 p.m. and 5 a.m.

(B) Transport passengers who are under 20 years of age.


(2) A licensee may drive between the hours of 11 p.m. and 5 a.m. or transport an immediate family member without being accompanied and supervised by a licensed driver who is the licensee’s parent or guardian, a licensed driver who is 25 years of age or older, or a licensed or certified driving instructor, in the following circumstances:

(A) Medical necessity of the licensee when reasonable transportation facilities are inadequate and operation of a vehicle by a minor is necessary. The licensee shall keep in his or her possession a signed statement from a physician familiar with the condition, containing a diagnosis and probable date when sufficient recovery will have been made to terminate the necessity.

(B) Schooling or school-authorized activities of the licensee when reasonable transportation facilities are inadequate and operation of a vehicle by a minor is necessary. The licensee shall keep in his or her possession a signed statement from the school principal, dean, or school staff member designated by the principal or dean, containing a probable date that the schooling or school-authorized activity will have been completed.

(C) Employment necessity of the licensee when reasonable transportation facilities are inadequate and operation of a vehicle by a minor is necessary. The licensee shall keep in his or her possession a signed statement from the employer, verifying employment and containing a probable date that the employment will have been completed.

(D) Necessity of the licensee or the licensee's immediate family member when reasonable transportation facilities are inadequate and operation of a vehicle by a minor is necessary to transport the licensee or the licensee's immediate family member. The licensee shall keep in his or her possession a signed statement from a parent or legal guardian verifying the reason and containing a probable date that the necessity will have ceased.

(E) The licensee is an emancipated minor.

(c) A law enforcement officer shall not stop a vehicle for the sole purpose of determining whether the driver is in violation of the restrictions imposed under subdivision (b).

(d) A law enforcement officer shall not stop a vehicle for the sole purpose of determining whether a driver who is subject to the license restrictions in subdivision (b) is in violation of Article 2.5 (commencing with Section 118947) of Chapter 4 of Part 15 of Division 104 of the Health and Safety Code.

(e) (1) Upon a finding that any licensee has violated paragraph (1) of subdivision (b), the court shall impose one of the following:

(A) Not less than eight hours nor more than 16 hours of community service for a first offense and not less than 16 hours nor more than 24 hours of community service for a second or subsequent offense.

(B) A fine of not more than thirty-five dollars ($35) for a first offense and a fine of not more than fifty dollars ($50) for a second or subsequent offense.

(2) If the court orders community service, the court shall retain jurisdiction until the hours of community service have been completed.

(3) If the hours of community service have not been completed within 90 days, the court shall impose a fine of not more than thirty-five dollars ($35) for a first offense and not more than fifty dollars ($50) for a second or subsequent offense.

(f) A conviction of paragraph (1) of subdivision (b), when reported to the department, may not be disclosed as otherwise specified in Section 1808 or constitute a violation point count value pursuant to Section 12810.

(g) Any term of restriction or suspension of the driving privilege imposed on a person pursuant to this subdivision shall remain in effect until the end of the term even though the person becomes 18 years of age before the term ends.

(1) The driving privilege shall be suspended when the record of the person shows one or more notifications issued pursuant to Section 40509 or 40509.5. The suspension shall continue until any notification issued pursuant to Section 40509 or 40509.5 has been cleared.

(2) A 30-day restriction shall be imposed when a driver's record shows a violation point count of two or more points in 12 months, as determined in accordance with Section 12810. The restriction shall require the licensee to be accompanied by a licensed parent, spouse, guardian, or other licensed driver 25 years of age or older, except when operating a class M vehicle, or so licensed, with no passengers aboard.

(3) A six-month suspension of the driving privilege and a one-year term of probation shall be imposed whenever a licensee's record shows a violation point count of three or more points in 12 months, as determined in accordance with Section 12810. The terms and conditions of probation shall include, but not be limited to, both of the following:

(A) The person shall violate no law which, if resulting in conviction, is reportable to the department under Section 1803.

(B) The person shall remain free from accident responsibility.

(h) Whenever action by the department under subdivision (g) arises as a result of a motor vehicle accident, the person may, in writing and within 10 days, demand a hearing to present evidence that he or she was not responsible for the accident upon which the action is based. Whenever action by the department is based upon a conviction reportable to the department under Section 1803, the person has no right to a hearing pursuant to Article 3 (commencing with Section 14100) of Chapter 3.

(i) The department shall require a person whose driving privilege is suspended or revoked pursuant to subdivision (g) to submit proof of financial responsibility as defined in Section 16430. The proof of financial responsibility shall be filed on or before the date of reinstatement following the suspension or revocation. The proof of financial responsibility shall be maintained with the department for three years following the date of reinstatement.

(j) (1) Notwithstanding any other provision of this code, the department may issue a distinctive driver’s license, that displays a distinctive color or a distinctively colored stripe or other distinguishing characteristic, to persons at least 16 years of age and older but under 18 years of age, and to persons 18 years of age and older but under 21 years of age, so that the distinctive license feature is immediately recognizable. The features shall clearly differentiate between drivers' licenses issued to persons at least 16 years of age or older but under 18 years of age and to persons 18 years of age or older but under 21 years of age.

(2) If changes in the format or appearance of driver’s licenses are adopted pursuant to this subdivision, those changes may be implemented under any new contract for the production of driver’s licenses entered into after the adoption of those changes.

(k) The department shall include, on the face of the provisional driver's license, the original issuance date of the provisional driver's license in addition to any other issuance date.

(l) This section shall be known and may be cited as the Brady-Jared Teen Driver Safety Act of 1997.

Amended Sec. 19, Ch. 1035, Stats. 2000. Effective January 1, 2001.
Amended Sec. 13.5, Ch. 758, Stats. 2002. Effective January 1, 2003.
Amended Sec. 4, Ch. 768, Stats. 2003. Effective January 1, 2004.
Amended Sec. 1, Ch. 337, Stats. 2005. Effective January 1, 2006.
Amended Sec. 2, Ch. 425, Stats. 2007. Effective January 1, 2008

[DKMYHEART]

Hello Again

I mean no offense to other law enforcement agencies. I just thought since these are California laws they would be the most familiar with the law. By all means anyone wanting to chime in please do so. I posted the CVC section on the subject so anyone reading it might have an opion.

[BJJVad]

If you can get something in writing from the school stating the unavailability of reasonable transportation.

My niece had an issue with this just recently. The school would not sign a letter due to a school pickup zone almost 3/4 of a mile from their house. My sister filled several complaints regarding the matter.

The outcome was an agreement for the school to make an extra stop outside their house. (L.A.U.S.D.)

Depending on the circumstance, you may run into a similar issue.

Welcome to the site..

[Samuel]

Dot all your i's and cross all your t's. Worse comes to worst, you'll have to prove exemption in court.

[Legoate]

The exemptions were written to allow brief exemptions for special cases. You are attempting to permanently circumvent the law. There are reasons lawmakers made the law to avoid having young drivers drive other minors.

[DKMYHEART]

The exemptions were written to allow brief exemptions for special cases. You are attempting to permanently circumvent the law. There are reasons lawmakers made the law to avoid having young drivers drive other minors.

I don't believe I'm intending to circumvent the law. I'm not wanting a pass at any other time other than to & from school. A government required activity! That they no longer supply a bus due to lack of funds. Not to the beach, movies, or anything else. The law says they have to go to school but they removed the means to get there. I think this was put in here for just my type of situation. The vast majority of people do not have a bed ridden parent. My children 16-1/2 & 15-1/2 have never missed or been late to school once since they started kindergarten. With the logic in this law I will have to buy another car, more insurance just so both of them can go to the same school. That's government. No thought of family needs. If I want to risk both my kids life, what business is it of theirs anyway? Plus siblings are a lot different than a car lode of friends. When the great GODS called law makers made this law up I guarantee they gave no thought at all the hardship they would cause some family's. There should be exemptions pertaining to siblings at the parents discretion. Like they love them more than we do? B.S.

[DKMYHEART]

If you can get something in writing from the school stating the unavailability of reasonable transportation.

My niece had an issue with this just recently. The school would not sign a letter due to a school pickup zone almost 3/4 of a mile from their house. My sister filled several complaints regarding the matter.

The outcome was an agreement for the school to make an extra stop outside their house. (L.A.U.S.D.)

Depending on the circumstance, you may run into a similar issue.

Welcome to the site..

I'll have to give that a try. They require attendance but eliminated the bus route. You have to live 5 mile from the school to be in a bus route. But maybe I can squeak loud enough to get some grease. Thanks

[Legoate]

Unfortunately in CA driving is not a god given right, as you seem to indicate by your posts. It is a highly regulated PRIVILEGE governed by thousands of laws written into the vehicle code.

You can disagree with me all you want- if I observed your child driving his sibling in this manner I would cite him. You could take it to court and argue all you want. I doubt that a judge would rule in your favor.

You came here asking for advice and I gave it. The fact that you don't agree with me doesn't make my advice any less valid.

[DKMYHEART]

Unfortunately in CA driving is not a god given right, as you seem to indicate by your posts. It is a highly regulated PRIVILEGE governed by thousands of laws written into the vehicle code.

You can disagree with me all you want- if I observed your child driving his sibling in this manner I would cite him. You could take it to court and argue all you want. I doubt that a judge would rule in your favor.

You came here asking for advice and I gave it. The fact that you don't agree with me doesn't make my advice any less valid.

So this section of the law would be disregarded by you right away without first investigating it. ((D) Necessity of the licensee or the licensee's immediate family member when reasonable transportation facilities are inadequate and operation of a vehicle by a minor is necessary to transport the licensee or the licensee's immediate family member. The licensee shall keep in his or her possession a signed statement from a parent or legal guardian verifying the reason and containing a probable date that the necessity will have ceased.). I'm glad your in texas. You started out accusing me of trying to cheat the law. All I was asking was how others interpreted this part of the law. Since asking my local experts yielded both yes & no's. A law so poorly written that even the Police & DMV can't agree on it's meaning. I have worked for 27+ years as a PEO/CSO and follow the law to the letter. That's exactly why I came here was for more options to help guide my decision. Not have my integrity questioned. And no S%$# it's a privilege, but it's also a necessity.

[Legoate]

I'm glad your in texas.

I'm not in Texas. Not sure where you got that idea. I live and work in California which is why I am familiar with the law you repeatedly quote.
My question for you would be how did your child get to school or daycare the 15 years prior to getting his license? Did something change for him the day he got his license which suddenly made it impossible for him to get to school?

Let your child drive. If he gets a citation, go to court and explain your side. There is a reason the state pays lawyers and judges a lot of money to argue these cases in court. We obviously have a difference of opinion on how the law should be interpreted that isn't going to be settled in this forum. You believe you are correct, I believe you are not. That's why a judge sits in that silky robe behind the big desk in traffic court- to settle disagreements regarding traffic law.

[DKMYHEART]

I'm not in Texas. Not sure where you got that idea. I live and work in California which is why I am familiar with the law you repeatedly quote.
My question for you would be how did your child get to school or daycare the 15 years prior to getting his license? Did something change for him the day he got his license which suddenly made it impossible for him to get to school?

Let your child drive. If he gets a citation, go to court and explain your side. There is a reason the state pays lawyers and judges a lot of money to argue these cases in court. We obviously have a difference of opinion on how the law should be interpreted that isn't going to be settled in this forum. You believe you are correct, I believe you are not. That's why a judge sits in that silky robe behind the big desk in traffic court- to settle disagreements regarding traffic law.

The change is: My Husband's health has deteriorated to the point he feels he would be risking their lives by driving them. My husband has a form of MS called Mythenia Gravis. It slowly eats away his ability to use my mussels. And he get dizzy spells too. We have no local family and friends proved to be very unreliable. My kids are both striving to complete school having never missed a day. This is the first year we have not been able to get them to school one way or the other. So they've had to walk. I thought this might not be so bad, getting their lazy asses out and moving a little. Too much computer & video games. But the daily walk with 40-60# backpacks has start having health problems. My 15 year old Daughter has been diagnosed with signs of scoliosis. My son turned 16 & got his license in June so we have not allowed him to drive them to school even though he had his license. He could not drive and let his sister walk alone. Then My daughter preparing to take her written test on the 29th read about these exemptions.So we started to check into it. But have found that everyone interprets this part of the law differently. I work out of the P.R. sheriffs station and have asked 2 traffic Sargents (1 yes, 1 no) dozens of Deputies and again a mix of yes & no's. Called the DMV and again some yes, some no. It's just coming down to the old "Officers Discretion" but that's risking my son's license. A high price. What I love about this law is at the beginning of next school year I will have 2 kids, driving separate cars to the same school. So mush for saving gas. lol. I hope i've explained my situation well enough. I feel like I bounced around a bit.