Firefighter with a few questions.. PLZ help

[Firefighter613]

hey guys,

i have a couple questions here.. i was with a buddy last night and we drove to a local bar/restaurant for a 21st birthday.. the place we went was expensive, so we both brought a beer in the truck to throw back in the parking lot when we got there. so we park and before we get out and chug the beer. right as we are getting out, (im passenger, buddy is driver) a SO says "hey guys, hold up".. im immediately thinking.. ####!!!.. as you can imagine..

so to cut it short, we got written citation for open container. mine was section 316.1936(2) because i was passenger.. I asked the officer some details about the ticket and he said that it was a non moving violation and that there were no points.. i also asked him if it was going to hurt my chances for hire with FD (currently holding all certificates and volunteering still trying to get hired).. he told me he had a citation for open container when he tested for SO..

so basically, here are my questions..

1) can someone explain to me a little better about non moving violations, and will they come up in a background/record check? and when a background/record check is done, can you see what the offense was, with details? or does it just show up as a traffic citation or non moving violation? etc.

2) i try not to play the "get out of jail free card".. i never tell a cop immediately that i am a firefighter, because that looks and sounds terrible.. and im sure you guys HATE when people throw that stuff out there.. however, normally when you get a ticket, its when your operating your own vehicle.. in this case i was passenger of a vehicle with no union sticker or otherwise, obvious sign of firefighter. I know you guys cut us a break sometimes when you see a union sticker, or what not....

so my question here is, if i had told him i was a firefighter before he headed back to his unit with our licenses, should i have told him? do you think he would have given me any kind of break or do you think it would have helped me by telling him that? .. and for future reference, should i let an officer know before he wrights a citation?

in case any of you are wondering, in in central Florida.

thank you in advance your time

[CityOfChicago]

I cant speak to FL, but here you as the passenger would be faced with two possibilities in your scenario: a physical arrest or a ordinance violation 'ticket'. If given the latter, you do have the option to appear and contest, but for something like open container (DOPW here) you will always lose. The citation is better because you mail in the payment and it's over with. It doesn't 'count against you', and it doesn't qualify as an arrest. Actually, its akin to a parking ticket. And so long as you pay the citation, thereby clearing any indebetness to the city, it's gone.

As far a telling the Dep you are a FF, I cant tell you how individual LEO's would respond. Ask your buddies.

[Sgt. Slaughter]

1) can someone explain to me a little better about non moving violations, and will they come up in a background/record check? and when a background/record check is done, can you see what the offense was, with details? or does it just show up as a traffic citation or non moving violation? etc.
If it's a criminal charge it will show up. He may have been trying to explain that you won't have points assessed on your license since it's not a moving violation.
2) i try not to play the "get out of jail free card".. i never tell a cop immediately that i am a firefighter, because that looks and sounds terrible.. and im sure you guys HATE when people throw that stuff out there.. however, normally when you get a ticket, its when your operating your own vehicle.. in this case i was passenger of a vehicle with no union sticker or otherwise, obvious sign of firefighter. I know you guys cut us a break sometimes when you see a union sticker, or what not....

so my question here is, if i had told him i was a firefighter before he headed back to his unit with our licenses, should i have told him? do you think he would have given me any kind of break or do you think it would have helped me by telling him that? .. and for future reference, should i let an officer know before he wrights a citation?
Being a volunteer firefighter is not a 'get out of jail free card.' Sounds like you've had contact with the cops more than once and I'm not talking about 'on the job' contacts either. If you think it will help, contest the citation in court (as it is your right to do) and tell the judge that.

[smcc360]

can someone explain to me a little better about non moving violations, and will they come up in a background/record check? and when a background/record check is done, can you see what the offense was, with details? or does it just show up as a traffic citation or non moving violation? etc.

It'll show up as an open container summons. I can't imagine the FD, or any other employer, making a big deal about it.

so my question here is, if i had told him i was a firefighter before he headed back to his unit with our licenses, should i have told him?

I wouldn't recommend it. It's irrelevant.

do you think he would have given me any kind of break or do you think it would have helped me by telling him that?

I can't speak for him, but it never made much of a difference to me when I was in uniform. Fireman, corrections officer, volunteer ambulance... great. License, registration, and proof of insurance.

Although the rumors I've heard suggest that Florida is a little funny about stuff like that, anyway.

.. and for future reference, should i let an officer know before he wrights a citation?

Again, I don't see the relevance. But every cop is going to have his/her own views.

[greg72982]

1) can someone explain to me a little better about non moving violations, and will they come up in a background/record check? and when a background/record check is done, can you see what the offense was, with details? or does it just show up as a traffic citation or non moving violation? etc.

At least in PA, I really don't see an open container citation being an issue for either police or fire, as it is a summary offense, which is considered non-criminal. I am not sure whether they may show up on a driving record but it wont show up on a criminal record.

That said, in PA there is a website where I can look your name up and see any violation you may have had, summary or criminal. It is through the courts, however, but it's not your criminal record so you should be honest and upfront about it.

Also the firefighter thing wouldn't make a difference with me.

[Firefighter613]

it says on the back of the ticket that it is a non-criminal traffic infraction.. and from what i am understanding, this is basically the same as a parking ticket?.. and what you said about paying it, and it disapears? does that mean once i pay it, it will not be on my record?

and to sgt. slaughter..

what i meant by get out of jail free card, was not that i dont get tickets or that i am above the law bc im a FF.. what i meant is that i dont like throwing an excuse or reason at LEO's to give me an upper hand.. and im a 'volunteer' bc its nearly impossible to find a job anymore as career.. the state is overly saturated with certified, unemployed firefighters, its rediculous.

thanks for the help

[Firefighter613]

smcc and greg, thanks for your replys

what did you mrean about the rumor in florida and being funny.. i dont understand..

its interesting to me that you guys feel that way about not making any difference. not that there is anything wrong with that, it just seems like in my run ins with you guys, i have apparantly caught a few breaks.. a state trooper cut my 75 in a 45 (with mandatory court appearance) down to 54 in a 45 because he understood how that would kill my chances in getting hired. and for a state trooper of all, i would never expect that..

so i dunno, maybe its different out side of Florida.. but thanks for the tips

[Sgt. Slaughter]

it says on the back of the ticket that it is a non-criminal traffic infraction.. and from what i am understanding, this is basically the same as a parking ticket?.. and what you said about paying it, and it disapears? does that mean once i pay it, it will not be on my record?

Cool! In Arizona an open container charge is a misdemeanor, not a traffic charge. Looks like once you pay it, it will be on your driving record, but that's it. Ask the court how long it stays on your motor vehicle record, they know all those little details.

and to sgt. slaughter..

what i meant by get out of jail free card, was not that i dont get tickets or that i am above the law bc im a FF.. what i meant is that i dont like throwing an excuse or reason at LEO's to give me an upper hand.. and im a 'volunteer' bc its nearly impossible to find a job anymore as career.. the state is overly saturated with certified, unemployed firefighters, its rediculous.

If you don't like 'throwing an excuse or reason' then just don't do it. Each cop is different as to how they handle these situations.

[retdetsgt]

The parts about the violation are all significant to the state you're in. I don't know squat about Florida.

As far as giving a break, most guys in my dept will give a break on minor stuff to firemen from our fire dept., but not just any that we come across. We have a pretty good relationship with them and like to keep it that way. However, I emphasize minor stuff. It's not a get out of jail free card by any stretch.

It doesn't hurt to mention you're fireman, no one will be harder on you for it, but don't necessarily expect a break either.

[InTheEnd]

Take care of the cite. You might have to disclose it in the hiring process.

[phantasm]

In NY its either state VTL law, ABC (alcohol beverage control law), or local law. Most likely its a violation, so in NY not considered a crime, but an infraction.

Take care of it.

If the FD you're going for is anything like FDNY, than it shouldn't affect it.

As for any discretion extended, that would depend on the individual officer. I know some cops who write EVERYONE and others who exercise discretion most of the time, and just wait for the guy with the attitude to get the summons, and everywhere in between.

I'm more towards the extend discretion to most people, unless I feel that the violations is dangerous enough to warrant a summons, or the defendant gives me the impression that he doesn't believe he did anything wrong.

[PapaBear]

hey guys,

i also asked him if it was going to hurt my chances for hire with FD (currently holding all certificates and volunteering still trying to get hired).. he told me he had a citation for open container when he tested for SO..


i try not to play the "get out of jail free card".. i never tell a cop immediately that i am a firefighter,

in this case i was passenger of a vehicle with no union sticker or otherwise, obvious sign of firefighter. I know you guys cut us a break sometimes when you see a union sticker, or what not....

so my question here is, if i had told him i was a firefighter before he headed back to his unit with our licenses, should i have told him? do you think he would have given me any kind of break or do you think it would have helped me by telling him that? .. and for future reference, should i let an officer know before he wrights a citation?

in case any of you are wondering, in in central Florida.

thank you in advance your time

I am curious about this:

You use the name Firefighter613 but you are not a firefighter!

It does not make any difference how much training you have had or what you may have done to further your career, if you are not sworn to an agency and working fulltime, you are a volunteer. To present yourself otherwise would be a violation of the law in CA.

So, just a word of warning, conduct yourself with professional comportment, do not pass yourself off as something you are not and when you do get hired keep all of this in mind because trying to use your position for personal gain or privilege is not legal in most states.

Good luck!

[Roger Dat]

If i read his posts properly it appears he may be a voly attempting to get on paid.

[Firefighter613]

I am curious about this:

You use the name Firefighter613 but you are not a firefighter!

It does not make any difference how much training you have had or what you may have done to further your career, if you are not sworn to an agency and working fulltime, you are a volunteer. To present yourself otherwise would be a violation of the law in CA.

So, just a word of warning, conduct yourself with professional comportment, do not pass yourself off as something you are not and when you do get hired keep all of this in mind because trying to use your position for personal gain or privilege is not legal in most states.

Good luck!

ok, seriously!?.. man you need to calm down.. i AM a firefighter.. the only time im NOT considered a FF is when one with 5, 10, 15 years on, says to me, im not because im not paid..

i hold a state certification stating that i AM a firefighter.. i volunteer only because im still testing with depts to get full time/career position.. to be a volunteer these days, you are required the same amount of training and certification as a paid career firefighter by NFPA.. the ONLY difference between me and a career guy, is that he is getting paid..

i hope you got your rocks off by flaming me..



to the other posts..

thanks for the reply. About FDNY.. unfortunately, they do things way different up there.. so im guessing its going to have a bigger impact..

i talked to my brother (FF for 6 years) and he said to hire an attorney and take a shot at getting it expunged/adjudicated?

honestly, i dont mind paying a ticket, i made a bad call, used bad judgment, and do not have a problem paying the price. However, i dont think that particular incident is one that should necessarily effect me for the rest of my life, or as far as career placement is concerned.. if it was a DUI or i was putting someone in danger, then yes, that would be another story.

any thoughts on me hiring an attorney, and trying to get this off my record? any experience with that?

thank you all for your time

[SnapShawt]

We have quite a few volunteer fire departments around here, and the guys and gals who put in time at those places are absolutely firefighters. They may not be full-time, paid firefighters, but they go through the same training and receive the same certifications and licensing, and are (and may absolutely refer to themselves as) firefighters. May be different in CA, I don't know. I do know that there are a LOT of volunteer fire departments around the this state anyway that are indispensable to the communities they serve.

In your case, how you refer to yourself depends. Are you currently a volunteer firefighter trying to become full-time, paid? Are trying to get on with a volunteer agency are not yet actually a firefighter? Are you already a volunteer but not as an actual firefighter?