Lawful civilian carrying of a firearm (Texas)

[Mr.Melon]

I'm hoping TxInvestigator can help out with this one, being my champion of the Texas Penal Code... I am 20 years old, and my father gave me a handgun, which to my understanding is legal. I know I can't get my CHL until 21 (which will be moot since I'll be in the police academy by then anyway), but I want to know what the laws are regarding minors NOT concealing firearms, specifically in two different situations:

1) Unloaded, in the trunk, with ammunition in the glovebox or elsewhere "up front," on the way to and from the gun range, and

2) While "traveling." I will be going on my honeymoon in June and want to be able to keep my handgun with me in the hotel room (or my shotgun, if it makes a difference). It seems to me that a two-week stay in a hotel room should qualify as a temporary "home," but obviously I'm a bit fuzzy on the legalese.

By my interpretation, there are (obviously) age restrictions on purchasing firearms (18 for long guns, 21 for handguns), but the TPC seems to clearly say that a parent giving a gun to their child is acceptable defense to a "minor" owning a firearm. I don't note any additional age restrictions listed in the sections describing legally transporting the firearms.

Clarification, please! I want to be legal about this!

[txinvestigator1]

lol

First things first. I am not an attorney, and the following is simply my understanding of the laws of Texas, and is not legal advice. ;)

The Texas Penal Code makes no age restriction for owning or possessing a firearm, even a handgun.

Texas law does restrict the carry of handguns.

Unloaded, in the trunk, with ammunition in the glovebox or elsewhere "up front," on the way to and from the gun range, and

Texas makes NO distinction between loaded and unloaded firearms. The penal code, section 46.02 states that a person committs an offense of Unlawful Carrying a Weapon if the person intentionally, knowingly or recklessly carries on or about his person a handgun, illegal knife or club.

On your person means just that. The courts have held that any area around you that is readily accessable is "about your person". So the trunk is not "on or about your person" and carrying a handgun there is not a violation of that law.

Section 46.15 of the penal code lists instances when 46.02 does not apply. A few of those are:

46.02 does not apply to a person who is;




(2) is on the person's own premises or premises under the person's control unless the person is an employee or agent of the owner of the premises and the person's primary responsibility is to act in the capacity of a security guard to protect persons or property, in which event the person must comply with Subdivision (5);

(3) is traveling;

(4) is engaging in lawful hunting, fishing, or other sporting activity on the immediate premises where the activity is conducted, or is directly en route between the premises and the actor's residence, if the weapon is a type commonly used in the activity;

Traveling has never been defined by law. I posted this answer about traveling.

As far as to and from the range, see number 4 above. The non-applicability means you could actually carry the gun on your person while en route between the premises and the range; however, I advise against it. A LEO would have no way to know you are going to the range. I suggest that those without CHL's leave the handgun secured in the trunk while traveling to and from the range.

I also encourage you to read Chapter 46 of the Texas Penal Code by clicking here.

If you have any other specific questions I will be happy to try yo answer.

[Mr.Melon]

Good; your interpretation of the TPC is the same as mine! ;) Some folks in my local gunshop felt differently, and I thought they might be knowledgeable about such things, so I felt I should check it out. I guess they probably just want to be careful, saying I can't do anything with guns until I'm 21!

But seriously, just to clarify about the hotel... I did read your other post, but I'm still curious about that part. Can I keep my handgun in the hotel room(assuming they don't have the specific sign banning firearms up in the entrance, of course)?

[txinvestigator1]

saying I can't do anything with guns until I'm 21!

I have this argument all of the time about under 21 people in possession. The best I can tell you is when someone tells you that, ask them to show you the law.

I had a gun range counter clerk AND a police academy graduate tell me the same thing a couple of weeks ago. The academy guy had his Penal Code with him, so I told him I was interested to hear that and asked him to find it so I could read the exact wording. He looked for nearly 15 minutes before he conceeded.

But seriously, just to clarify about the hotel... I did read your other post, but I'm still curious about that part. Can I keep my handgun in the hotel room(assuming they don't have the specific sign banning firearms up in the entrance, of course)?

Once you reach your destination, I don't believe you meet the traveling exemption. However, would your hotel room be your "premises" for your stay? I have no case law to go by.

I would think you would be fine with it in your room. I would not leave it in the room when I was not there though. Too much of a chance for theft. And also remember that most likely every wall will have people on the other side of it.

[P01IC3M4N]

I know I can't get my CHL until 21 (which will be moot since I'll be in the police academy by then anyway),

why not go ahead and get it? i just sent off for mine. for $25, there's no reason not to.

I had a gun range counter clerk AND a police academy graduate tell me the same thing a couple of weeks ago.

you do know that is time you will never get back right? :D

[txinvestigator1]

you do know that is time you will never get back right? :D

Yeah. LOL I was there anyway and 3 guys, all under 21 came in and wanted to shoot their pistols. The range dude wanted to tell them they could not shoot because they could not "legally possess" the guns. :drug:

[Reapp]

As traveling has never been defined by the appelate courts it falls under a "defense to prosecution" more than anything. I have arrested several for UCW that said they were "traveling", with their marijuana/cocaine/heroine, while intoxicated. ;)

[txinvestigator1]

As traveling has never been defined by the appelate courts it falls under a "defense to prosecution" more than anything. I have arrested several for UCW that said they were "traveling", with their marijuana/cocaine/heroine, while intoxicated. ;)

Traveling is no longer a Defense to Prosecution. If one is traveling, then UCW, 46.02, does not apply to that person.

§46.15. Nonapplicability.



(b) Section 46.02 does not apply to a person who:

(1) (As added by L.1997, chap. 1221(4). See other paragraph (1)
below.) is in the actual discharge of official duties as a member of
the armed forces or state military forces as defined by Section
431.001, Government Code, or as an employee of a penal institution
who is performing a security function;

(1) (As added by L.1997, chap. 1261(28). See other paragraph
(1) above.) is in the actual discharge of official duties as a member
of the armed forces or state military forces as defined by Section
431.001, Government Code, or as a guard employed by a penal
institution;

(2) is on the person's own premises or premises under the
person's control unless the person is an employee or agent of the
owner of the premises and the person's primary responsibility is to
act in the capacity of a security guard to protect persons or
property, in which event the person must comply with Subdivision (5);

(3) is traveling;



(6) is carrying a concealed handgun and a valid license
issued under Article 4413(29ee), Revised Statutes, to carry a
concealed handgun of the same category as the handgun the person is
carrying;

[Valor55]

Unless you can carry your gun when you leave the hotel room, I'd advise against taking it with you. Hotel rooms are very unsecure. Half the hotel staff have access to your room and a few go in and out (the maids and their supervisors checking their work.) Half the employees are probably convicted felons too. The hotels aren't stupid, they put the bright eyed college students at the front desk the rest are probably making minimum or only slightly better. When I travel I am prepared to lose anything I leave in the room. Everything else stays with me or in my car (which is another terrible place to 'secure' a firearm.) And don't think you're clever, I'll bet the first place they look is under your underwear in the drawer.

[Mr.Melon]

Originally Posted by Mr.Melon
I know I can't get my CHL until 21 (which will be moot since I'll be in the police academy by then anyway),



why not go ahead and get it? i just sent off for mine. for $25, there's no reason not to.

I don't know, here's my timeline...

July 18 - Police academy starts
August 24 - 21st birthday

The academy is only six months long, and we actually get our peace officer license three months in, so that'd be mid-October. I'm thinking I'll just wait. Plus, the class is like $150, and I thought the application was quite a bit more than $25, but I could be wrong.

Anyway, is the general concensus that the risk of theft of the gun outweighs the risk of needing to use it? Not being able to actually "carry" the gun, you'd opt to leave it at home?



Tx, you're still my TPC hero.

[P01IC3M4N]

[I]Originally Posted by Mr.Melon
The academy is only six months long, and we actually get our peace officer license three months in, so that'd be mid-October.

3 months? that's not enough hours to qualify for the test. it'd take at least 4 months going 40 hours a week.

[Mr.Melon]

Meh, I only repeat back what the recruiting/personnel officers have told me.