New Guy - Seemingly simple question

[RedcarinNY]

hello everyone, i am new (obviously) i opted not to introduce myself in the other forum as i felt it would have been redundant....lol. so before i asked my question i thought i would introduce myself here. Hello!

My question is as follows:

Last night i received a speeding ticket. My radar detector alerted me that there was a KA band around, i had a very small signal from it so i moved to the middle lane and slowed down (to approx. 64-66 in a 55) immediately i see the headlights come up in my rear view mirror. i know it is a law enforcement officer. he stays behind me for about 1-2 min, running my plates i assume (which are clean), and then throws on the lights and pulls me over. the coversation went somewhat like this:

"License Please"
-"Yes, sir, here you go"
"You do know why I am pulling you over right?"
-"Actually no sir, I know i was doing about 65 or 66 when you were behind me there"
"Well you were doing around 80-85 back there at *street name*"
-"O, well ok sir."

then the officer walks away. now i am not sure i was going that fast, i honestly was not looking, if i slowed down to 64 or 65 then i was probably doing around 70-75. my question is that no where on the ticket does it say the method of which he obtained my speed. in the Description of Violation box it simply states "State speeding limit" No where on the ticket does it say 'radar', 'pace radar' or anything of the sort. how do i konw wha method he used and how does he know that i was going that speed? is he guessing? i say that because i was told by another sheriff (it was a NYS Sheriff that pulled me over) that officers are certified by the state to guess the speed of a vehicle within 5+/- MPH. if that is the case wouldn't this guess be skewed by various factors. i.e. - going around a turn, hitting a hump in the road. the simply fact that my car is red and has a nice appearance?

i do plan to fight the ticket based solely on the fact that i don't belive i was going that fast so i highly dobt he had me 'clocked' going that fast. once agin my radar detector alerted me or no 'laser' or even a strong KA signal. i know it is not admissable in court, yet i still feel it is grounds for discussion.

any and all light you ladies and gentlemen shed on this matter would be greatly appreciated.

thank you.

RedcarinNY

[DeltaV]

If you weren't really looking, how do you know that you weren't going that fast? I'd advise you to just pay the citation. If you go to court with that story, the judge is going to find you guilty.

Down here, we put how we obtained the speed measurement on the citation. In addition, we put the serial number of the radar/laser unit on the citation. I don't live or work in New York, so maybe it's not a requirement up there.

[txinvestigator1]

The "I don't know how fast I was going but I don't think it was X speed" is always an effective defense.

You could also try the "he's stupid and I'm not" defense.

[scott715us]

Pretty thick on the sarcasm from the other officers, but they are pretty much on the money.

If you were not sure how fast you were going, then it's a closed case. Feel free to fight the ticket, but if the officer did use radar, then you're dead in the water. Just because he didn't write or check "radar" on the ticket does not mean he didn't use it.

The most obvious point in this scenario:

WHETHER YOU WERE DOING 66 OR 110 MPH, OVER THE SPEED LIMIT IS OVER THE SPEED LIMIT.

I see this every month in court. The complainant demands that they were not going 67 in a 45 zone. The judge asks, "ok, how fast were you going then?" and they reply "oh, about 55."

It's still over the posted speed limit, it is still speeding. Sorry ;)

[GoDirectly2Jail]

How often do we have to read the EXACT. SAME. THREAD. by somebody with 1 post count?

I swear it's getting hilarious!!

[Valor55]

How often do we have to read the EXACT. SAME. THREAD. by somebody with 1 post count?

I swear it's getting hilarious!!

I'm still waiting for someone to show up and use some imagination though.

[TX-LEO]

yawn

[RedcarinNY]

Well thank you all for the responses and the sarcasm which I thoroughly enjoyed. Terribly sorry for not capitalizing the letter "I"; I assure you that I do in fact know that it refers myself.

I attempted to be a nice person hoping to get a nice, kind, informative response, which I did receive from you all. However, I feel as though the sarcasm was completely unnecessary. That is unless you were simply attempting to prove your immaturity. I felt as though were are all adults and should verbalize as such. Apparently I was mistaken, at least for the vast majority of you.

I never once said I was going to court to say that "Your Honor I was not speeding and have never sped in my life." I even stated to the officer that I WAS IN FACT speeding, no where near what he "guessed" I was doing, but never-the-less speeding.

I was simply asking if any of you Officers had specific information pertaining to my case, as I was unable to find such information available online. I suppose next I will simply go and obtain a few NYS law books and read up on them. Perhaps even check to see if there is a legal speed suvey on record.

scott715us - Thank you for you kind response and, yes I do agree I was speeding. I’m not denying it. What I am saying is that 20-30 MPH over the posted speed limit (which had JUST dropped down from 65 MPH when he pulled me over) is a 6 point ticket and, I would assume, a rather hefty fine. I was just trying to keep my points down as I have never had a pont-bearing ticket of any sort nor been involved directly with the law. The reason I asked if there was any other way to tell how he clocked my speed was because in the past I have seen various tickets where there were 3 or perhaps 4 boxes available to be checked. 'Radar', Pace Radar', etcetera. Thank you though.

All of that said Thank You all for the responses. I appreciate the cold hard truth. The sarcasm not so much. But perhaps we all still have a bit of growing up to do.

RedCarinNY

Also – I hope my grammar, aside from a few run-on’s and perhaps a fragment or two, is acceptable to you DC Law, if you would like I can translate it all in to Spanish. Or perhaps French, do you speak either of those? Here’s an English word for you: Sophomoric.

[fatboyjim154]

Yeah, yeah, yeah forget all about the radar.

Was he wearing his hat?

[RedcarinNY]

As a matter of fact, No, he was NOT wearing his hat! Lol.

RedCarinNY

[Citicop]

Also – I hope my grammar, aside from a few run-on’s and perhaps a fragment or two, is acceptable to you DC Law, if you would like I can translate it all in to Spanish. Or perhaps French, do you speak either of those? Here’s an English word for you: Sophomoric.

I think you summed up both your question and your attitude nicely there at the end...enjoy your fine and the points on your license.

Citicop.

PS- If you are so much smarter than we dumb cops are (you know, trilingual, big vocabulary, etc...) then WHY did you come here and ask us a question?

[RedcarinNY]

My attitude was not toward everyone, it was directed toward DC Law. I was not trying to be rude or anything. BUT, why would a mature Officer of the Law act like that? I asked a simple question. I even introduced myself and such, all the norm of forums. I just felt it was not necessary to start the topic off on a sour note.

If I did sound rude I am sorry, that is not what I was trying to do.

Also, as far as your comment about being 'smarter than you dumb cops', I actually have the utmost respect for Cops as well as other law enforcement officers. I never ONCE stated that ANY of you were dumb, you may have read into my reply that way, and for that I can not apologize. And the reason I am here asking you all is because it is supposed to be your profession. I would assume that you are rather skilled in it and could give me a bit more 'real life experience' than I could possibly have by looking through books. '...enjoy your fine and the points on your license.' Once again, immaturity I feel. It is as though you are saying "So THERE, stupid kid!" Come on now, you seem like a very nice person, could you not have said "Well, you may try to fight it, however I believe that the chances are you will still receive points and have to pay a fine." If your statement were anything close to that I would have agreed completely and wholeheartedly.

I'm sorry if I came off as rude or crass, I did not intend to. I would like to say thank you for the continued responses.

Thank You

RedCarinNY

[Joeyd6]

i had a very small signal from it so i moved to the middle lane and slowed down (to approx. 64-66 in a 55) immediately i see the headlights come up in my rear view mirror.

"License Please"
-"Yes, sir, here you go"
"You do know why I am pulling you over right?"
-"Actually no sir, I know i was doing about 65 or 66 when you were behind me there"
"Well you were doing around 80-85 back there at *street name*"
-"O, well ok sir."

then the officer walks away. now i am not sure i was going that fast, i honestly was not looking, if i slowed down to 64 or 65 then i was probably doing around 70-75. my question is that no where on the ticket does it say the method of which he obtained my speed. in the Description of Violation box it simply states "State speeding limit" No where on the ticket does it say 'radar', 'pace radar' or anything of the sort. how do i konw wha method he used and how does he know that i was going that speed? is he guessing? i say that because i was told by another sheriff (it was a NYS Sheriff that pulled me over) that officers are certified by the state to guess the speed of a vehicle within 5+/- MPH. if that is the case wouldn't this guess be skewed by various factors. i.e. - going around a turn, hitting a hump in the road. the simply fact that my car is red and has a nice appearance?

i do plan to fight the ticket based solely on the fact that i don't belive i was going that fast so i highly dobt he had me 'clocked' going that fast. once agin my radar detector alerted me or no 'laser' or even a strong KA signal. i know it is not admissable in court, yet i still feel it is grounds for discussion.

any and all light you ladies and gentlemen shed on this matter would be greatly appreciated.

thank you.

RedcarinNY

1) Openly admit you slowed to 64 or so when the limit was 55.
2) Lie when the officers asks if you know why he pulle dyou over and say "no" when you were in fact knowingly speeding 10 mph over the limit.
3) Officers in NY State are not certified to "guess a vehiles speed." nor required to guess. Just guess it is traveling at least or more than the legal posted limit.
4) NYS tickets do not require me to list how I know you are speeding.
5) My radar will hit your car and give me your speed before you ven here one alert on your detector.
6) "i do plan to fight the ticket based solely on the fact that i don't belive" Great. Go to court with that one. Evidence you submit, including verbal testimony is to be based on FACTS, not what you believe. Judges will dismiss what you think.
7) You will get hammered here in NY. I assure you. Theses judges do not care what you think is the truth and what your detector said. You already admitted you were 9-10 mph over the limit.

Shut-up and pay your fine. You want leagl advice on how to beat a ticket...go hire a lawyer.

[207]

7) You will get hammered here in NY. I assure you.

Does NY also hammer 'em for having a radar / laser detector? CT will and I do note that one was in the vehicle in my narrative.

[RedcarinNY]

So much hostility.

I'm going to stop arguing everyone here. I appreicate all of your comments.

However, your comment about me getting hammered in NY is a bit much. As well as your statement about me going to court based not on facts. I beleive I was not going 85, I also believe that he was guessing at my speed Therefore making it not a fact. Thank you very much for anwsering all of my questions that I had origonally asked, I do appreciate that. But I do have a question for you, if officers are not required to put how I was pulled over, how does that hold up in court? I mean, could you guess my speed simply on the way my car sounds, for example? Or perhaps how it looks while driving? I am not being sarcastic, I am being really sincere

I'm not arguing with you or anything, I just wanted to state my opinion.

Thank you.

RedCarinNY