Concealed Carry Question

[Kermz811]

I thought I might pose this question to the people who know it best. Pertaining only to licensed concealed carry permit holders: If I have been pulled over for a minor traffic violation, and give the LEO my drivers license and concealed carry permit, does the LEO have a right (explicitly written) to take my gun and/or unload it without my permission. The reason I ask is not because I am anti LEO, in fact I hold a very high regard for what you do, it is just to protect myself. EX. I get pulled over on a country road, but not by a cop it is by an impersonator, I would hate to hand them my gun so they could shoot me with it. Keep in mind that in this scenario the only thing I have done wrong is a minor traffic violation, there is no suspicion of another crime, and no probable cause.
What’s the deal, since I am carrying legally, do I have to give up my gun?

[Kermz811]

Maybe I should have should have specified an unmarked car, but the way in which you wrote to me seems demeaning. Secondly, if you don’t think that things like that happen in the real world, then you need to open your eyes. There is nothing wrong with inquiring as to my rights. I would rather have an understanding of the law and be safe than to be ignorant and dead. Finally, I don’t understand why understanding the law equals paranoia.

[Kermz811]

I am asking for explicit written law, not common practice.
If it is the law, then of course I will follow it.

[Nuklhed]

Hey Kermz, one thing you must understand is that you came into here asking us. If you got an answer you didnt like, it is not a reason to go bashing the person who gave their answer to your question.

That cop has every right to go home at the end of the night. I am going to do what it takes for that to happen. If that means holding on to your weapon while we talk, well then that is what I am going to do.

[Nuklhed]

Dang it, I wanted to answer your question, but I hit the send button too quickly. If you really want to know the answers to your questions, Check with your local Police department, especially if there isnt one of them represented on here.

[tpd_six]

Yes, you have to temporarily surrender your weapon if the officer wants to hold onto it for his safety. It's something we do every day, and as DC said, if you want to argue and fight with us over it, you will end up losing your permit. Cops are not anti-gun, in fact you will have a hard time finding a cop who deosn't believe in CCW. The reality is when we stop you, we don't know who you are, if your permit is valid, or what is going on in your mind. A traffic stop can turn into a dangerous confrontation with flared tempers far too easily, and temporarliy taking possession of weapons is a necessity.

Why would you even think you need to "defend" yourself from an officer? it's this kind of dangerous thinking that does lead to fights, arrests, and shootings. A cop in an unmarked car is no less of a cop than one in a marked unit. If you think cop impersonators are running rampant taking people's guns, I agree it's a case of paranoia.

The officer will check your weapon to make sure it's not stolen, check the status of your permit, and return it to you at the end of the contact unless it's being held as evidence in some crime.

[scott715us]

Just to add on to TPD's answer, I recently pulled over a gentleman that informed me he had a CCW permit upon obtaining his drivers license. I immediately asked if he had the weapon in the vehicle and he said no. Following a DL check, I was advised by dispatch that an order of protection had been issued and his CCW permit was invalid and he was not allowed to have a weapon. So, I'm not sure about the exact law where you're from, but I'd say my scenario would give you a good idea of a reason why we may ask for the weapon. Stay safe ;)

[Kermz811]

The last thing I want to do is bash an officer. I know your jobs are tough enough without people getting on your case about the finer details of the law. This is why the question came to mind. I routinely drive home through the country at night. One night after I had read about a family being attacked in a motel room by police imposters it got my wheels turning. What if some car pull off a dirt road tried to pull me over, how do you know it’s a cop? Well if it’s an unmarked car, then it might be very difficult to determine. I just wanted to know if I must surrender my firearm if I am directed to do so; after all I was issued the license by the state after a background check. If I got pulled over in the city I would have much less of a problem handing it over. I also agree that a cop has every right to go home at the end of the night, and that it does make good sense for them to take possession of a gun while reviewing the situation. On the other hand, I have that same right and would feel very vulnerable handing over my firearm if I was not certain that they were in fact a police officer.

[scott715us]

The last thing I want to do is bash an officer. I know your jobs are tough enough without people getting on your case about the finer details of the law. This is why the question came to mind. I routinely drive home through the country at night. One night after I had read about a family being attacked in a motel room by police imposters it got my wheels turning. What if some car pull off a dirt road tried to pull me over, how do you know it’s a cop? Well if it’s an unmarked car, then it might be very difficult to determine. I just wanted to know if I must surrender my firearm if I am directed to do so; after all I was issued the license by the state after a background check. If I got pulled over in the city I would have much less of a problem handing it over. I also agree that a cop has every right to go home at the end of the night, and that it does make good sense for them to take possession of a gun while reviewing the situation. On the other hand, I have that same right and would feel very vulnerable handing over my firearm if I was not certain that they were in fact a police officer.

I have yet to see an unmarked unit that is hard to determine whether he/she is law enforcement or not, at least in my state. All the unmarks have plenty of blue lights, and required to have an audible siren. The police officer will have a distinguishable uniform, or if in BDU's should have a badge visible. From these "imposter stories" I have heard of, the cars may have had one light or a different color other than a LE color, and the persons were not displaying anything that said POLICE or an identifiable badge. It is sad, but many people think any FORD vehicle with a light on top is a police officer. They do not take the time to learn the agency vehicles in their state/town or the uniforms of their officers. If you feel a little peeved about wondering if the person is legit, go to the LE agencies in your area and inquire on all the uniforms the patrol officers where, whether it be state/local/county, etc. If you have plain clothes officers, then they should identify themselves by a proper badge and photo identification, but I rarely see them make a traffic stop.

[mcsap]

Believe that it IS a cop unless you have STRONG doubts to believe otherwise. I sometimes drive an unmarked but am ALWAYS in full uniform.

[Kermz811]

So when can you assert YOU RIGHTS?

[Joeyd6]

I must say folks...anyone who hands me a CCP or tells me they have a weapon on them with their license (and no LE ID) is not going to be doing anything with their hands but keeping them up, becuase my side arm will be out of the holster very fast while explaining where I want their hands. Nobody will "surrender" or "hand" me anything. I will be taking it myself. Permit or not...the only hand on that gun, legal or not, will be mine. We can take care of the details later, after I have it. I am sure we ll are on the same page with that. But I agree with DC on post #12.

[JD45]

Secondly, if you don’t think that things like that happen in the real world, then you need to open your eyes.

HAHAHAHAHA!!! Our eyes ARE open...they take in much more than you could even begin to comprehend...

[steelcityk9cop]

So when can you assert YOU RIGHTS?

You will get to assert your right to remain silent if you don't comply when the officer asks for your gun! If you have an issue not believing that you are being stopped by a real officer, throw your hazzards on and head real slow to a well lit area with your dome light on. Dial 911 and confirm with the dispatcher that you are being stopped by a real officer...... when all the marked units start showing up that's a good sign that the one you didn't think was a cop peobably is. Not surrendering your firearm when requested to will get you an arrest record, loss of your permit, and in most places the melting of your gun!

[Deputy757]

In KY, a CCW permit holder is not required to advise an officer that he has the permit or is armed upon being stopped. Many do however because they know that should an officer discover this on their own, the reaction will probably be altogether different than if they are up front about it. Reading through this thread, they may determine that this belief may be in error (especially after reading Joeyd6's response).
Playing devil's advocate for a moment Joey, shouldn't you be using the same tactics with someone who claims to be a LEO? Anyone could claim to be a LEO and there have also been lots of actual LEO's who have gone off the deep end or ones who kept department ID after being let go. If the name of the game is officer safety (at all costs) then it shouldn't matter who is at the other end of the firearm.
Anyway, my policy when presented with a CCW permit is to ask for them to tell me where the firearm is without pointing or reaching for it. I can quickly verify if the permit is active or temporarily/permanently suspended due to a domestic violence order or other reason. If it's not, then I continue with the traffic stop. Of course, many things could affect this situation. The person's attitude, the type of infraction, the area of the county we may be in, etc. In my opinion, it's not the person who tells me there is a firearm in the vehicle (when I never would have known otherwise), that poses the biggest risk (note I did not say poses any risk).
I think everyone should use whatever method they find makes them comfortable. I, and no officer I know, would ever presume to tell another officer what is appropriate when it comes to officer safety issues. The above is just my personal take on the matter.