Police Jobs
RealPolice Forums
Police Gear
Police Agencies

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 24

Thread: Scenario 1

  1. #1
    Jynkxxie Guest

    Scenario 1

    O.k. Lets do something fun.

    The police arrested Quentin on a murder charge, booked him, and put him in jail because he couldn ot make bail. Shortly after he was first jailed, Dectective Angstrom read Quentin his full Miranda rights, and asked if he would answer some questions regarding the murder with which he was charged. Quentin responded, "I want a lawyer, and I might talk to you after I talk to the lawyer." Over the weekend, while Quentin was still in jail, a court-appointed lawyer visited him and discussed the charge. (the lawyer did not anticipate that Quentin would be questioned again, so he did not tell Quentin that he should remain silent if Questioning resumed.) On Monday morning, Detective Butts came in to Quentin's cell, ascertained that Quentin had met with the lawyer, gave Quentin his Miranda warnings again, and asked him if he would now discuss the case. Quentin agreed to do so. In response to the questions by Butts, Quentin implicated himself in the crime. May these incriminating statements be introduced against Quentin at the trial? Would the answer be the same if Quentin had chosen to remain silent rather than demand and attorney?

  2. #2
    metallicat's Avatar
    metallicat is offline Veteran Member metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute
    Supporting Member L2
    Supporting Member L4
    Join Date
    Mar 23rd, 2003
    Location
    Edmonton AB, Canada
    Posts
    4,955
    I know you want opinions from cops, and probably American law, but I read the Charter of Rights section on right to counsel for Canada, and my best understanding is that the suspect wanted to speak with counsel and got his wish. Shouldn't the lawyer have understood that the police were now free to question the suspect? I think the detective once again informing the suspect of his right to have an attorney present was waived, and that gave the police the freedom to interrogate the suspect. I think the self-incriminating statements would be admissible. And if the suspect had wished to remain silent, I believe it is the duty of the police to wait until he/she has reasonable time to consult with counsel. At least in Canada. And I could be totally wrong too considering I don't have experience in this area.
    Made In Canada

    I'm digging my way to something better

  3. #3
    Ghost 1's Avatar
    Ghost 1 is offline Hammer Down Ghost 1 has a reputation beyond repute Ghost 1 has a reputation beyond repute Ghost 1 has a reputation beyond repute Ghost 1 has a reputation beyond repute Ghost 1 has a reputation beyond repute Ghost 1 has a reputation beyond repute Ghost 1 has a reputation beyond repute Ghost 1 has a reputation beyond repute Ghost 1 has a reputation beyond repute Ghost 1 has a reputation beyond repute Ghost 1 has a reputation beyond repute
    Verified LEO
    Join Date
    Mar 13th, 2004
    Location
    Right next door to hell
    Posts
    726
    If he initially said he wanted a lawyer,and got one,once he says he wants to talk it's on him. He was read his rights a second time and he said he understood his rights and wanted to talk.........yes the confession is admissible.

  4. #4
    Darin's Avatar
    Darin is offline Jacked up on Mt. Deeeewww Darin has a reputation beyond repute Darin has a reputation beyond repute Darin has a reputation beyond repute Darin has a reputation beyond repute Darin has a reputation beyond repute Darin has a reputation beyond repute Darin has a reputation beyond repute Darin has a reputation beyond repute Darin has a reputation beyond repute Darin has a reputation beyond repute Darin has a reputation beyond repute
    Supporting Member L3
    Verified LEO
    Join Date
    Dec 11th, 2002
    Location
    Mid Atlantic area
    Posts
    13,731
    I agree with Ghost1. He talked to his lawyer and was even read his Miranda the second time. Ol Q should fry ;)
    Sixburgh
    6 time Super Bowl Champions

    They were who we thought they were.

    Playoffs?? Playoffs!!??? Don't talk about PLAYOFFS!!!??

  5. #5
    Jynkxxie Guest
    O.k. what about the second question.

    Thanks for the replies guys!

  6. #6
    Darin's Avatar
    Darin is offline Jacked up on Mt. Deeeewww Darin has a reputation beyond repute Darin has a reputation beyond repute Darin has a reputation beyond repute Darin has a reputation beyond repute Darin has a reputation beyond repute Darin has a reputation beyond repute Darin has a reputation beyond repute Darin has a reputation beyond repute Darin has a reputation beyond repute Darin has a reputation beyond repute Darin has a reputation beyond repute
    Supporting Member L3
    Verified LEO
    Join Date
    Dec 11th, 2002
    Location
    Mid Atlantic area
    Posts
    13,731
    Well if Q excersized the right to remain silent and then started talking then I think it should stand up in court.
    Sixburgh
    6 time Super Bowl Champions

    They were who we thought they were.

    Playoffs?? Playoffs!!??? Don't talk about PLAYOFFS!!!??

  7. #7
    Switchback's Avatar
    Switchback is offline Just milling around... Switchback has a reputation beyond repute Switchback has a reputation beyond repute Switchback has a reputation beyond repute Switchback has a reputation beyond repute Switchback has a reputation beyond repute Switchback has a reputation beyond repute Switchback has a reputation beyond repute Switchback has a reputation beyond repute Switchback has a reputation beyond repute Switchback has a reputation beyond repute Switchback has a reputation beyond repute
    Moderator
    Supporting Member L2
    Verified LEO
    Join Date
    Dec 31st, 2001
    Location
    In the middle of a cornfield.
    Posts
    12,956
    You can decide to speak anytime. Just because you initially refuse to waive your rights does not mean you cannot waive them later. Admissable.
    We bring evil things to evil people, kicking in a door near you!

    ."In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. But,
    in practice, there is."

    - Jan L.A. van de Snepscheut

    "The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is like
    an eggs-and-ham breakfast: the chicken was 'involved' - the pig
    was'committed'."

    -unknown

    Working on a PhD in CQB one doorway at a time.

    When the wolf attacks, he will find not all who run with the flock are sheep!

  8. #8
    wpd11's Avatar
    wpd11 is offline Narcotics Investigator wpd11 is on a distinguished road
    Verified LEO
    Join Date
    Mar 20th, 2004
    Location
    Wellsville Ohio
    Posts
    52

    True

    This is true (admissible )
    _______WARRANT_________

  9. #9
    mcsap is offline Veteran member ( retired) mcsap has a reputation beyond repute mcsap has a reputation beyond repute mcsap has a reputation beyond repute mcsap has a reputation beyond repute mcsap has a reputation beyond repute mcsap has a reputation beyond repute mcsap has a reputation beyond repute mcsap has a reputation beyond repute mcsap has a reputation beyond repute mcsap has a reputation beyond repute mcsap has a reputation beyond repute
    Moderator
    Supporting Member L2
    Verified LEO
    Join Date
    Mar 7th, 2003
    Location
    Penciltucky
    Posts
    21,885
    Lone voice in the wilderness here. If a def invokes the "lawyer phrase" we cannot further question him without a lawyer present. Period.

    Now if the accused calls us and wants to tell us ANYTHING, fine as long as we dont interrogate.


    Spontaneous statements are also fine.

    This is our state law.
    Creeper Cop

  10. #10
    gdowkpc's Avatar
    gdowkpc is offline Maintaining the Vigil gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute
    Supporting Member L2
    Verified LEO
    Join Date
    Mar 8th, 2003
    Location
    Oregon
    Posts
    2,547
    I was going to say what MCSAP said. I believe that you cannot question a suspect who has obtained a lawyer without being in the presence of his lawyer.

    When a suspect asks for a lawyer, all questioning must stop unless the suspect initiates the conversation.

    I think I just re-stated the above post, but this is honestly what I was thinking before I read it.
    In time we hate that which we often fear.
    Visit nwham.com for accurate Ham Repeater information.

  11. #11
    metallicat's Avatar
    metallicat is offline Veteran Member metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute
    Supporting Member L2
    Supporting Member L4
    Join Date
    Mar 23rd, 2003
    Location
    Edmonton AB, Canada
    Posts
    4,955
    So are you guys saying that in Jynkxxie's scenario, the statements would NOT be admissible?
    Made In Canada

    I'm digging my way to something better

  12. #12
    gdowkpc's Avatar
    gdowkpc is offline Maintaining the Vigil gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute gdowkpc has a reputation beyond repute
    Supporting Member L2
    Verified LEO
    Join Date
    Mar 8th, 2003
    Location
    Oregon
    Posts
    2,547
    Yes.
    In time we hate that which we often fear.
    Visit nwham.com for accurate Ham Repeater information.

  13. #13
    metallicat's Avatar
    metallicat is offline Veteran Member metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute metallicat has a reputation beyond repute
    Supporting Member L2
    Supporting Member L4
    Join Date
    Mar 23rd, 2003
    Location
    Edmonton AB, Canada
    Posts
    4,955
    You lost me gdow. I don't understand why a suspect can't waive his right after he talked to a lawyer the first time.
    Made In Canada

    I'm digging my way to something better

  14. #14
    wpd11's Avatar
    wpd11 is offline Narcotics Investigator wpd11 is on a distinguished road
    Verified LEO
    Join Date
    Mar 20th, 2004
    Location
    Wellsville Ohio
    Posts
    52

    He can

    If the suspect wishes to speak to the police he/she can at there own free will. He said that he would first talk to his lawyer then would make a decision. He did talk to his lawyer and was advised of his rights again and stated that he wanted to talk. Anything that he said would be admissable in a court of law. There is case-law out there on this exact subject. He would be on his way to prison. Plus if he was already charged for the crime without his statement then the probable cause was against him anyways. His statement must not have been needed.
    _______WARRANT_________

  15. #15
    mcsap is offline Veteran member ( retired) mcsap has a reputation beyond repute mcsap has a reputation beyond repute mcsap has a reputation beyond repute mcsap has a reputation beyond repute mcsap has a reputation beyond repute mcsap has a reputation beyond repute mcsap has a reputation beyond repute mcsap has a reputation beyond repute mcsap has a reputation beyond repute mcsap has a reputation beyond repute mcsap has a reputation beyond repute
    Moderator
    Supporting Member L2
    Verified LEO
    Join Date
    Mar 7th, 2003
    Location
    Penciltucky
    Posts
    21,885
    True, if the suspect wants to talk to us, make a statement to us after asking for a lawyer, he/she can do that as long as we dont interrogate. We can just smile, say uh-huh and write or tape it down.
    Creeper Cop

  16. This ad will disappear if you login

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts