US laws of arrest

[txinvestigator1]

In a recent Ask A Cop thread a verified officer wrote that a LEO can arrest "if he thinks a crime has probably been committed"

Can someone explain that to me? Did he mean "upon probable cause", which is a completely different thing?

[Citicop]

Can you point to the thread in question?

I haven't seen that specific thread, but in reading your comments, I could see an implied "...by the suspect." at the end of that statement, which would make it " a LEO can arrest 'if he thinks a crime has probably been committed by the suspect.'"

Which is not far off from what the Oxford Companion to American Law says, which is that Probable Cause is:

information sufficient to warrant a prudent person's belief that the wanted individual had committed a crime (for an arrest warrant) or that evidence of a crime or contraband would be found in a search (for a search warrant).

-Citicop.

[ET109]

Yeah that was me, worded it badly.

[G35 Mass]

Probable cause is the standard for arrest. It is "more likely than not", which is simply the 51% standard.

A great way I use to explain probable cause to people: Imagine the scales of justice. If all of the facts are pebbles, and when you put all those pebbles on the scale, if it leans ever so slightly towards "he did it", probable cause exists.

[McNulty]

In a recent Ask A Cop thread a verified officer wrote that a LEO can arrest "if he thinks a crime has probably been committed"

That's exactly what probable cause means.

[txinvestigator1]

That's exactly what probable cause means.

Really? huh

[Kimble]

[G35 Mass]

OP, is there something on your mind?

Or are all your questions answered?

[McNulty]

Really? huh

Yes, really.

I'm curious why someone with the name 'txinvestigator1' hasn't been forced to get verified yet.

edit: Your situation has been explained to me via PM.

[Cat_Doc]

Tx can speak for himself, of course, but I think we are better served when describing "probable cause" in more specific terms than "thinking a crime probably occurred."

ET109 manned up and has already admitted that better descriptors could have been utilized.

[McNulty]

Tx can speak for himself, of course, but I think we are better served when describing "probable cause" in more specific terms than "thinking a crime probably occurred."

ET109 manned up and has already admitted that better descriptors could have been utilized.

Sure, there's probably more eloquent ways to describe it, but that doesn't change the fact that the initial quote is still an accurate definition of probable cause. Hell, the way our academy's lawyers defined probable cause to us was "A was crime probably committed, and the person you're considering arresting probably committed it based on the evidence you have."

[Cat_Doc]

Sure, there's probably more eloquent ways to describe it, but that doesn't change the fact that the initial quote is still an accurate definition of probable cause. Hell, the way our academy's lawyers defined probable cause to us was "A was crime probably committed, and the person you're considering arresting probably committed it based on the evidence you have."

That is a much better description than the one offered that a "crime probably occurred." As mentioned earlier, ET109 noted that himself.

We all know that above all else the elements of a crime have to be present and articulated. Then we have to articulate the totality of circumstances that would lead a reasonable and prudent officer, not present, but in a similar scenario, to believe that the suspect, did in fact, commit the crime.

ps. I would have a major issue if I saw a report submitted by one of my officers that simply said he/she thought there was "probably" a crime committed, wouldn't you?

[Kimble]

I'm curious why someone with the name 'txinvestigator1' hasn't been forced to get verified yet.

To clarify, Tx is a longtime member, former LEO, and now a private security investigator. He's good people.

[greg72982]

Hell, the way our academy's lawyers defined probable cause to us was "A was crime probably committed, and the person you're considering arresting probably committed it based on the evidence you have."

Ours was something like: "A set of facts and circumstances that would lead a reasonable person to believe that the accused committed the crime."

[G35 Mass]

To clarify, Tx is a longtime member, former LEO, and now a private security investigator. He's good people.

Which makes this entire post even that much more "suspect"...