Police Officer Preparation & Law Enforcement Resource - Archive

I'm not going to paste this article, it's too long. But it's an interesting read and explains another reason why people don't believe government is a good steward of their money.

Too bad we couldn't get one of these jobs.....:rolleyes5: Especially some of these city managers of small towns in California that make $300K+ a year.

20 government workers with super-sized pay - The Red Tape Chronicles - msnbc.com (http://redtape.msnbc.com/2010/10/20-government-workers-with-super-sized-pay.html)

"Any government that robs Peter to pay Paul can always count on the support of Paul" - George Bernard Shaw

AND a sore peter? Ever tried to do business with a sore peter?

AND a sore peter? Ever tried to do business with a sore peter?

Depends on the business you're in, I suppose. Being a cop, I was usually on the receiving end of such business exchanges....

I'm not going to paste this article, it's too long. But it's an interesting read and explains another reason why people don't believe government is a good steward of their money.

Too bad we couldn't get one of these jobs.....:rolleyes5: Especially some of these city managers of small towns in California that make $300K+ a year.

20 government workers with super-sized pay - The Red Tape Chronicles - msnbc.com (http://redtape.msnbc.com/2010/10/20-government-workers-with-super-sized-pay.html)

Other than myself...an entrepreneurial person who will never see a pension....a majority of the people I know here in DC have benefitted from double dipping. I don't hold it against them at all...good for them that they were good long range planners....but I think we're all gonna be doing a little more belt tightening soon.

Yeah, right, overpaid, thats govt employees, too bad they dont have a clue...
They definately cant include Kansas.
Half of the 14 years I worked for the state, I qualified
for food stamps.....

Fact is, until the Kansas Highway got its last big pay increase,
a new dog catcher in Olathe Kansas started at more than a TROOPER.

I don't mind the "double dipping" with one caveat. If you come back, you have no seniority on the pay scale. This is what makes retirement economical for government in that the retiring teacher gets replaced by a new college graduate. If the state is going to pay out retirement, they should also get the benefit that the replacement worker is paid what the normal replacement gets. If that person is retired they should also collect in cash what the state would have put towards their retirement. States will have to start scrapping pensions if rules aren't put in place to reduce the cost burden.

For Jack Harris, I would have given him choice of continuing at his salary without retirement or getting pension and getting the lowest command staff salary plus whatever Phoenix pays into the PSPRS. Treat those re-hires as if the deparment was promoting from within and calculate ultimately what the cost is and that's what they get paid.

I have no problem at all if they seek private employment after public service. Public employment means the state is paying their salary, the retirement plus unemployment for the person that would have replaced them.

Now every public employee in the state of Oregon are on the same pension system. You can't double dip here working for another state, county or city agency after retirement. You can work a temporary government job, but only put in so many hours per year. I'm not sure what it is, but it's not much. Private sector is nobody else's business.

I was mostly appalled by the salaries of some of those city managers and the SF deputy chief getting $516K a year. The job ain't that hard.

I believe in decent pay and admit I took the job for the pay, but some of the pay of administrators is ridiculous.

I guess I could be accused of "double dipping" as I retired from the city after doing twenty (1998) and have been collecting my pension. I immediately went to work in a different retirement system and am hoping to collect a second pension from it.

However, there is no friggen way I am making the kind of money as in the list and I am definitely earning it.

and I am definitely earning it.

You definitely won't get an argument from anyone on that :)

I doubt any public employee or elected official makes $200K a year, double dipping or not.

The sad thing is the state is facing a huge budget short fall and of course everyone is blaming state employees for it. Up until the mid 80's, the property taxes here were draconian because we have no sales tax. An initiative passed limiting how much they could raise it, but in it was a clause that took school funding away from local districts and made the state pay it. That's been a disaster because now they are trying to protect schools and OSP from cuts which means everyone else bites it.

State workers have been taking furlough days for about a year now and layoffs are looming. I think they got the last pay raise they're going to see for a long time. The problem is they still waste more money on frivolous junk all the time.

I just read where my department is cutting back OT and not filling empty slots now. Of course the city council still finds plenty of money for bicycle lanes and other amenities for riders plus a half a million to buy outdoor toilets for the homeless. But that's the problem in government, the money thrown away by administrators and elected people. Regular employees aren't responsible, but they take the blame for it.

I'm so glad I'm retired and that my wife retired from the state last February.

I doubt any public employee or elected official makes $200K a year, double dipping or not.


Pay scandal, resignation deflate City Council in Bell, California - CNN.com (http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/10/05/california.bell.council/?hpt=T2)

Pay scandal, resignation deflate City Council in Bell, California - CNN.com (http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/10/05/california.bell.council/?hpt=T2)

Sorry, I meant in Oregon. The California ones are why I posted that.

http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll71/canoraid/HatersGonnaHate.jpg

:biggrinjester:

Sorry, I meant in Oregon. The California ones are why I posted that.

State of Oregon Government Salaries, Wages, and Benefits | GovDocs (http://theoregonpolitico.com/govdocs/state/salaries/?agency_name=POLICE%252C%2BOREGON%2BSTATE%2B%2B%2B %2B%2B%2B%2B%2B%2B%2B&class_title=&first_name=&last_name=&total=11&campaign=1&page=1)

I just looked at state police. I bet there's a lot though.

Look at Department of Human Services. $300k in Oregon.

Dept of Corrections and the State Treasury havr highest salaries in OR state govt.

Never mind then. I didn't bother to look it up, just guessed. The head of Human Services is an MD.

Shot my mouth off without checking, boy that's a first!:skep: :smilielol5:

http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll71/canoraid/HatersGonnaHate.jpg

:biggrinjester:

Naw, I izzn't hatin'.

Again, I took the job initially for the money, not the fame and glory! Not to mention the benefits and job security was a huge bonus. Not many people in the private sector have that. And I have a good pension now, it's more than enough for what I require. In reality, I wouldn't have taken the job for what some make doing it in other parts of the country.

But on the other hand, I know where that money's coming from and it's not like I have a choice as to what and how much taxes I have to pay. I worked for the government my whole life and the attitude that tax money is somehow free money is prevalent throughout it. And greed is greed. We've fired more than a few cops for getting a little heavy with the pencil filling out OT slips. IMO, good riddance, a thief is a thief.

Mike caught me on the state of Oregon and I have to admit that the head of Human Services makes that money, but he also earns it. That's by far the biggest single division in the state. But a city manager of a town with 30K people or so earning $800K is criminal, IMO.

I couldn't care less about someone double dipping. If you earned the pension and got hired again, that's fine with me. We only went to the state system a couple of years ago so a number of my peers retired and did what Cat_Doc did. More power to them.

I've never b!tched about the taxes I pay, but I have complained a lot about where that money goes. Bush had the right idea by using faith based charities to distribute money because they're efficient. I bet at least 40% of government money is wasted on either administrative costs or just pissed away. And yeah, it makes me more than a little ticked when I see some person making extravagant money doing a job that ain't that hard when it's my money paying him. There is such a thing as "enough money".

I was just kidding Sir - big time. I remember jokes about government spending - like a nasa space shuttle certified toilet seat cover or spatula or something mundane costing like $500.00 each or something like that. Governments and politicians piss me off so much on a regular basis that I try not to think about what they're doing (cause it will only piss me off more). It's real easy to spend money that's not your own. It's real easy to make laws and decisions that don't and won't affect you or anyone you know. I don't like to wish bad upon people but some people, and not just the gang bangers and POSes we deal with on a daily basis, need some difficulties thrust upon them... Wouldn't mind seeing all the current office holders be replaced by the previous runner ups for awhile - see if that might help (although IMO it's all about lesser evils so we're probably not gonna do too much better)...

I got the joker at the bottom, Samuel.:thumbsup:

It's just one of those things that drives me crazy(ier). Where my wife worked for the state, they didn't have enough state cars in their pool for people to do their job. Meanwhile, the neighbor across the street from me had a state car parked in his driveway all the time. He literally left his house about 3 days a week and was gone less than a few hours each time.

I found out later he was an inspector for barber shops and beauty shops, but he couldn't have been working more than 10 hours a week, seriously. I wrote to the governor's office and just complained about the use of the car and I got a form letter back they send when someone writes in about a state worker violating a traffic law. :rolleyes5:

And they wonder why they have a billion dollar shortfall? And as I said in another post, the public is going after the people that really are out there busting their butts just trying to make a living....

I'll shut up now......:coolgleamA:

Sooner or later, they're gonna beat their cash cow (we, the middle class) to death - and then what?

Sooner or later, they're gonna beat their cash cow (we, the middle class) to death - and then what?

Have faith. Change is a comin'. IMHO.

I got the joker at the bottom, Samuel.:thumbsup:

It's just one of those things that drives me crazy(ier). Where my wife worked for the state, they didn't have enough state cars in their pool for people to do their job. Meanwhile, the neighbor across the street from me had a state car parked in his driveway all the time. He literally left his house about 3 days a week and was gone less than a few hours each time.

I found out later he was an inspector for barber shops and beauty shops, but he couldn't have been working more than 10 hours a week, seriously. I wrote to the governor's office and just complained about the use of the car and I got a form letter back they send when someone writes in about a state worker violating a traffic law. :rolleyes5:

And they wonder why they have a billion dollar shortfall? And as I said in another post, the public is going after the people that really are out there busting their butts just trying to make a living....

I'll shut up now......:coolgleamA:

Here they threaten the public with less police, fire, teachers whenever there is a budget shortfall. Voters just approved a tax hike to "save police jobs". Meanwhile, the state is putting in car pool lanes on the freeway and repaving perfectly good roads because those are "federal Obamabucks". It's the idea that there are all these separate buckets of money that must be spent that gets me. "We need money to save police/fire/teacher jobs! Why not use the money that you are wasting on building new carpool lanes, empty city buses and useless light rail? Oh, that's different money." It should be criminal fraud to raise taxes to pay for essential services when optional services are fully funded.

It all comes out of my pocket so why does the arbitrary bucketizing remove it from consideration of cuts? The family that is going hungry doesn't keep the vacation piggy bank "separate" so why does the Govt?

Make the Dept heads annual salary 0. Then he gets a percentage of whatever he comes in underbudget. Make his financial persons salary fixed less a percentage of what the dept comes in under or over budget. That makes the finance guy doing the budget have an incentive to have a budget close to reality and gives the head guy an incentive to save. Suddenly I think we would see trimmer and more accurate budgets.

They don't threaten with that here. In fact, some areas pass separate bond measures directly for police or fire. People don't mind paying taxes for that as long as the money is dedicated.

You have to pay a good salary to attract good people. If you do the 0 salary thing, who would apply for that job? Ya gotta be realistic. And if the salary depends on cuts, then you have a window for corruption and lack of services to people who need them.

What I would do in state government is put an auditor in each division or department to monitor spending. And I would rotate them every 3 years or so in order that they don't develop the "Stockholm syndrome". And the auditors reports would be published annually and sent to all tax payers.

They don't threaten with that here. In fact, some areas pass separate bond measures directly for police or fire. People don't mind paying taxes for that as long as the money is dedicated.

You have to pay a good salary to attract good people. If you do the 0 salary thing, who would apply for that job? Ya gotta be realistic. And if the salary depends on cuts, then you have a window for corruption and lack of services to people who need them.



Zero was illustrative. My point was that making the department head be thrifty is to his advantage. And make the financial budget person be accurate to his advantage. They would check and balance each other. If the head guy finds a lot to cut, the person who asked for that stuff should be held accountable. Likewise, if the budget is very accurate and everything needs to be spent, then the budget guy should be rewarded but no bonus should go to the head guy, just whatever his salary is. And if the head guy is cutting essential services, the finance guy has an incentive to report it. Auditing should always be done every year by outside accounting firm just like public companies.

Financial incentives in government will lead to corruption. You're right in that accountability is the problem, but bonuses don't create accountability.

Here they threaten the public with less police, fire, teachers whenever there is a budget shortfall. Voters just approved a tax hike to "save police jobs". Meanwhile, the state is putting in car pool lanes on the freeway and repaving perfectly good roads because those are "federal Obamabucks". It's the idea that there are all these separate buckets of money that must be spent that gets me. "We need money to save police/fire/teacher jobs! Why not use the money that you are wasting on building new carpool lanes, empty city buses and useless light rail? Oh, that's different money." It should be criminal fraud to raise taxes to pay for essential services when optional services are fully funded.

It all comes out of my pocket so why does the arbitrary bucketizing remove it from consideration of cuts? The family that is going hungry doesn't keep the vacation piggy bank "separate" so why does the Govt?

Make the Dept heads annual salary 0. Then he gets a percentage of whatever he comes in underbudget. Make his financial persons salary fixed less a percentage of what the dept comes in under or over budget. That makes the finance guy doing the budget have an incentive to have a budget close to reality and gives the head guy an incentive to save. Suddenly I think we would see trimmer and more accurate budgets.

I agree with you, Mike. Yep, it's the catch all "they will cut police/fire/teacher" Democrat scare tactic that's just as mindless as the catch all scare tactic " it will cost jobs" for us Republicans. I know it's asking a lot, but be an informed voter or stay the hell home is what I want to say to a lot of voters......

Financial incentives in government will lead to corruption. You're right in that accountability is the problem, but bonuses don't create accountability.

Yep, there is absolutely no correlation between bonuses and accountability here in Washington. I would argue it's inverse. We watch the sharks who play organizational politics get the promotions and bonuses, and the few who fight the waste get sidelined. Having lived here and worked around it for so long, I'd say about 85% of the time it's inverse. Yep, I'm pretty cynical. The left hand never knows what the right hand is doing in this federal bureaucracy, and God forbit you try to correct that.

The thing I noticed was that a lot of the salaries seemed to be inflated because there was some type of payment/pay out during the year, Sick leave and disability seemed to show up a lot.

What got me was the City managers or whomever it was whose pension was then boosted by as much as $70K because of the payout of their accrued annual and sick leave. If that isn't a sweet deal I don't know what is!!