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View Full Version : Someone spits on you. . .


Nykon
02-25-02, 06:00 PM
is it considered assault? how do you defend yourself against somebody spitting on you? if some homeless guy spits on you because you didn't give him change, can you teach him a lesson? if you hit him/her, would they be able to take you to court for anything?


cjw2k
02-25-02, 06:37 PM
I don't know of a legal way to defend yourself against someone who spits on you but hitting them is not the right solution because then you can be charged.

lprocter
02-27-02, 06:44 AM
Yeah, I don't think spitting is covered under the definition of assault. It might be under something like public morals (maybe the same sort of thing as public nudity) but I think it would be a real long shot. As for 'teaching him a lesson,' that is a very bad idea. The only thing you could legally do is to spit back a him, which, needless to say, is very stupid. All you should do is just smile, wave and walk away.


FOP900
02-27-02, 07:15 PM
In New York State, spitting on a person is covered under the harrassment statute, unless the person spits on someone knowing that he is infected with a contagious disease. :(

Armed and DWI
03-01-02, 02:43 PM
Originally posted by lprocter
Yeah, I don't think spitting is covered under the definition of assault. It might be under something like public morals (maybe the same sort of thing as public nudity) but I think it would be a real long shot. As for 'teaching him a lesson,' that is a very bad idea. The only thing you could legally do is to spit back a him, which, needless to say, is very stupid. All you should do is just smile, wave and walk away.

Wait so are you real police saying that if a suspect or just a pull-over spits on you while on duty, that you would just smile and walk away? There is nothing you can do to that person?

FOP900
03-01-02, 07:01 PM
Someone spits on me there will be problems....

lprocter
03-01-02, 08:48 PM
Nothing I would do to that person. Seriously, why get violent when I don't have to? How do I know that the guy I just pulled over doesn't have a knife in his pocket? It's not worth risking injury cause you got a bit of some other guys spit on you. I'd just forget about it. Who cares?

LBomb
03-01-02, 08:54 PM
Spitting in Phila is treated as harrasment. Also a City Ordinance violation. Teaching the spitter a lesson isn't such a good idea...well...it is a good idea, but one that could get you jammed up.

badattitudecop
03-02-02, 12:31 AM
In MT I would charge the person with assault. If it is me or another officer that is spit on the person would be charged with assault with bodily fluids. Good luck.

Hothandz
03-02-02, 01:28 AM
Hey FOP, what if we were Swapping Spit? what would u charge me with on that? huuuuuuuuh?

realpolice
03-02-02, 08:58 AM
We arrest here for assault if they spit. And yes, I'd consider it the same as someone throwing a punch. They would definitely be eating the cement in about 0.002 seconds.

FOP900
03-02-02, 08:20 PM
Swapping spit?? ... HH, baby, I may have to charge you with Assault with a Deadly Tongue if you do it right!!

Switchback
03-02-02, 09:37 PM
Strike another one up for assault.

zander_zye
01-06-03, 08:55 PM
Spitting can be considered battery (assault is the attempted act - battery is actual contact).

Never never never spit back on a convict even if he has spit on you. The reasoning is this - IA will ask you "were you trained to spit on convicts if they assault you ?" The obvious answer is NO. But you were trained to take out their kneecaps with your PR24.

Moral of the story - when someone spits on you. Don't spit back. Just take out their kneecaps like you were trained to do...

(silly - but true)

:rolleyes:

replay
01-06-03, 09:22 PM
I was taught in college (not the academy) in multiple CJ classes that spitting is considered an assault (or battery, forget which, or is open to interpretation). During my oral interviews with scenario questions, a scenario was where someone spit on me, and what I would do from there. I said to back away would be to lose face, not only for yourself, but for all other officers and the PD. You allow him to get away with that, next time maybe he'll take it a step further. What happens when he does it in front of others that can take in the same ideas? It's okay to spit on officers but not hit or touch them? Anyway, I passed that scenario question.

Darin
01-06-03, 09:36 PM
Originally posted by zander_zye
Spitting can be considered battery (assault is the attempted act - battery is actual contact).

Never never never spit back on a convict even if he has spit on you. The reasoning is this - IA will ask you "were you trained to spit on convicts if they assault you ?" The obvious answer is NO. But you were trained to take out their kneecaps with your PR24.

Moral of the story - when someone spits on you. Don't spit back. Just take out their kneecaps like you were trained to do...

(silly - but true)

:rolleyes:
Now I like that reply! Being spit on ... That is one of my "buttons" that shouldn't be pressed.

txinvestigator1
01-06-03, 09:38 PM
Spitting can be considered battery (assault is the attempted act - battery is actual contact). That would depend on the state one was in.


Never never never spit back on a convict even if he has spit on you. The reasoning is this - IA will ask you "were you trained to spit on convicts if they assault you ?" The obvious answer is NO. But you were trained to take out their kneecaps with your PR24.Moral of the story - when someone spits on you. Don't spit back. Just take out their kneecaps like you were trained to do...(silly - but true)

I hope you are kidding, as striking a prisoner in retaliation (it would not be self-defense unless the spitting was continual) for spitting would land one in very hot water. Striking is way up the continuum compared to spitting.




said to back away would be to lose face, not only for yourself, but for all other officers and the PD. You allow him to get away with that, next time maybe he'll take it a step further.

A Police Officers job is NOT to save face for you or the other officers. The way you dont let him "get away with it" is not by retaliating, but by filing any appropriate criminal charges.

What if he punches you in the face, then immediately lays down on his stomach with his hands behind his back. You gonna kick his *** so he "doesnt get away with it"?

Attitudes like this and some wonder why the media keep playing all of the videos of cops abusing, oh sorry, teaching suspects a lesson.

Darin
01-06-03, 09:42 PM
Awww geeez Tx can't we have a lil fun???:D

txinvestigator1
01-06-03, 09:47 PM
Oh believe me, I have been the "spittee" on more than one occasion. And any of you who have been here long can probably guess that I was less than happy about it. ;)

However, rather than retaliate one solution is to pull the offenders shirt up over his head, removing his ability to spit on anyone but himself. It also removes his vision, often calming even the most agitated.

Shirtless offenders are another matter, but thats why paper bags were invented.

Darin
01-06-03, 09:51 PM
That is the best way to handle it with out a doubt. It takes a lot of self control to handle it like that but thats how I would handle it too.

replay
01-06-03, 10:02 PM
Tx,
Hmm. Not sure if you did not like my post because you thought that I would 'retaliate' by hitting him back, or because you don't think I have a reason to be upset? My view is that if he spit on me, I would not let him get away with it. I would cite or arrest him, whatever the punishment allowed for.

txinvestigator1
01-06-03, 10:07 PM
Replay

;) :D

resqr1
01-06-03, 10:26 PM
I have witnessed a beautiful use of that magnificent invention called...DUCT TAPE. When used properly with the right amount of layers, it makes a most useful spit shield. And hurts like hades when it comes off. Also a wonderful remover of nasty, unwanted facial hair.:D

vadep
01-07-03, 02:55 AM
Spitting on me is gonna get you charged with Felony Assault on a Police Officer. The plastic face shields typically carried by most EMS squads are a great way to put and end to the spitting.

navyfiveo
01-07-03, 04:46 AM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by vadep
[B]Spitting on me is gonna get you charged with Felony Assault on a Police Officer.


See, this is what I loved about being a Deputy in VA. In cases like these, those judges tend to throw the book, desk and book shelf at folks who assault police officers.

In the old navy, being spit on would have cost you a fine by the Commanding Officer and a couple of teeth by the spitee. In today's kinder, gentler Armed Forces we would be required to instruct the person not to do that again, then issue a lawful order not to do it again, then insist that he was going for the steering wheel in the car and thet's why he got his head slammed into the dash.

Solego
01-07-03, 07:25 AM
If someone spit on me while I was onduty, I would ARREST them for Battery on a Law Enforcement Officer, a felony charge!!!

Andi_Banana
01-07-03, 07:42 AM
Im Michigan it's looked at as assault.

zander_zye
01-07-03, 09:55 AM
Been there and done that TX.

If you read my very first post it was about how to explain a stupid act by a certain young Deputy. I had a very assaultive inmate spit on me not once, but several times. I allowed this scrote (mild term for convict) to get to me (yes, stupid, but it happens) What did I do?, I simply spit back. It wasn't an aggressive act, nor was it in retaliation. It was simply a response. (before you get into a tizzy, what how would you respond if someone much bigger than you walked up to you and backslapped you?? - you would probably just repond the best that you could)

Because I am so stupidly honest. (unlike most Deputies at the time), I reported the event. What did it get me? Well - the probabtionary period on this dept was 24 months, and I was on my 23rd month (most departments are between 12-18 months). You can guess what happened. The investigating SGT asked just the thing that I said in a previous post, "Where you trained to spit back on an inmate?" The obvious answer was no. I was trained to repel the act. Because we only had short-sticks that is how we were to repel the act (hence, take out the convicts kneecaps). That seemed a bit drastic, but it is how Deputies were trained and that was the way we were supposed to handle the situation.

(you are probably thinking: Why didn't I just walk away? - simple answer was that I had to continue to walk the convict down the compound, There was no backup because their was only 5 Deputies on duty for 1300 felony convicts - everyone else had their hands full.)

Whew - long story - don't spit....

txinvestigator1
01-07-03, 10:02 AM
Aahh yes, I do remember that thread Zander. Correctional officers do face a daunting task.

zander_zye
01-07-03, 10:09 AM
I was not a CO. I don't say this with any disrespect to CO's, but in CA the difference is like night and day.

A CO requires a GED and a 6 week academy.

A Deputy (which is the same as any officer under 830.1) requires a 23 week (or longer) academy. Most dept. also require an AA or better.

Working in the jail was just one of the many necessary assignments which included patrol, civil, transportation, etc.

Yes - working in a jail - especially one of the largest county jails in Northern CA was a tauting task....

Mongo
01-08-03, 07:15 PM
Generally, assault is when you place somebody in fear for their life or of bodily harm through an overt act such as a verbal threat or physical gesture. A battery is basically an unlawful, offensive or harmful touching.

I believe spitting fits the definition for battery, and not assault. And as far as I know, a battery on a LEO is some serious sh*t.

But doesn't it really depend on the situation? Would you guys treat all spitters the same? I imagine that with a homeless person, loaded on cheap wine, it just wouldn't be worth tacking on a battery charge. I haven't been there, though, just my opinion.

indycop
01-08-03, 10:18 PM
In Indiana spitting on a LEO is covered under IC 35-42-2-6, Battery by Body Waste, and is anywhere from a Class D felony to a Class A Felony, if the victim is a LEO or CO. If the victim is not either of these, the offense is a Class A Misdemeanor to a Class B Felony. The range is dependant on whether or not the spitter is infected with certain diseases (HIV, TB, Hepatitus, etc), and whether or not the victim contracts said disease. Even if there is no disease or transmission, a person who spits on a LEO is guilty of the D Felony charge.

scan
01-09-03, 02:29 PM
I find it incredible that just spitting at a cop is a felony

Mongo
01-09-03, 02:45 PM
Scan,
There's a lot that the legislature takes into account when drafting laws. For example, domestic violence used to be no big deal in the law books. With more understanding, the legislature took action and changed laws. For example, in many jurisdictions it is mandatory for police to arrest in a domestic violence situation, even though it might be a misdemeanor.

While spitting, in and of itself, may not cause much harm, there are a lot of policy considerations that go into classifying it as a felony when perpetrated against a LEO. Basically, it's a deterrant consideration in this context. We don't want people spitting on cops for various obvious reasons. If it's a felony, it really makes people think twice, even in the heat of passion or drunkeness, about doing it. You just don't go there. It's not just spitting though, it's any kind of a battery against a LEO.

Solego
01-09-03, 02:48 PM
I find it incredible that you find that incredible. If some dirtbag pisses me off, I find a legal reason to take them jail. The first time the public learns that they can take advantage of you, it will never stop. You ever try working in a county where you share a hundred square mile zone with only one other deputy? You learn to demand respect. Either that or get your *** beat, literally.

txinvestigator1
01-09-03, 02:49 PM
I find it incredible that just spitting at a cop is a felony

Really? This is one way society has decided to protect it's defenders.

How many communicable diseases can be transfered via saliva? Hepatitus for one.

scan
01-09-03, 03:02 PM
OK, you guys changed my mind----diseases


I FOUND it incredible cause I FOUND it ridiculous that someone serving 5 yrs for just spitting

Azexp7
01-09-03, 11:45 PM
In my L.E. class we learned of a case where an idiot spit on a L.E.O. when she was pregnant, and she contracted hepatitus.(if I remember correctly it was C):mad:

txinvestigator1
01-10-03, 12:15 AM
Solego

Just saw this in your reply;

If some dirtbag pisses me off, I find a legal reason to take them jail.

So there are laws in your state making it illegal to piss you off?

How long have you been a cop?

indycop
01-10-03, 07:08 AM
scan - a felony doesn't necessarily mean 5 years...it is anything over one year. Also, around here, your first felony is a freebie - alternate misdemeanor sentencing means your first one is bumped to a misd. Of course, thanks to the judges, your next 3-20 felonies will also get you little more than a slap on the hand. You have to have a loooonnggg record around here to do any time, unless you commit domestic battery, in which case, you'll be lucky to get anything short of a life sentence for your first offense :D :D :rolleyes:

Officer down
01-10-03, 05:48 PM
Michigan: Assault and Battery

Assaulting a police or fire person:

An individual who assault, batters, wounds, resists, obstructs, opposes, or endangers a person who the individual knows or has reason to know is performing his or her duties is guilty of a felony punishable by imprisonment for not more than 2 years or a fine of not more than 2,000 or both.

Battery is:
A willful touching of the person of another by the aggressor or by someone substance put in motion by him, and is the consummation of an assault.

A batter is a forceful, violent, or offensive touching of the person or something closely connected with the person of another.

Stump
01-10-03, 06:05 PM
That applies to firefighters also? Why?

And would you arrest someone if they spit on you when you were offduty (not in uniform) and they knew you are a cop? Would you only arrest as "an assault on an officer" if you were acting in the capacity of an offduty officer at the time of the "spittage"? Or would you arrest as just an assault? Or would you not arrest at all?

Officer down
01-11-03, 01:12 AM
Originally posted by Stump
That applies to firefighters also? Why?

And would you arrest someone if they spit on you when you were offduty (not in uniform) and they knew you are a cop? Would you only arrest as "an assault on an officer" if you were acting in the capacity of an offduty officer at the time of the "spittage"? Or would you arrest as just an assault? Or would you not arrest at all?

All that is from a legal text I keep with me.
Also, itís classified under, "Assaulting a police or fire person", so about the fire persons: In my opinion (which never counts anyway heh) is that they have a job to do, duties to do, as well to protect society. Because the word "obstruct" is used, and "obstruct" includes the use of threatened use of physical interference or force or a knowing failure to comply with a lawful command. Such as a firemen trying to do his job but the person who lit the fire wants to interfere with that. Maybe far fetched, but it's an example. I didn't name this "assault".

For the rest of your questions, I cannot say. It all depends on the situation and what is going on.

America
01-12-03, 08:17 AM
Hey Nykon (forgot your name)...I'm not a cop but you know - alot more of the homeless are mentally ill than the average population. But if your pretty sure he's just rude. I'd call him a socialist who EXPECTS money to be handed out when it should be given from those who DECIDE to. I might mention that I give to charities only and to select people...and not to assume that I give to no-one on the street. (That's what he's doing uness he's assuming your rich. You could have just handed ou alot of money to several or more people earler and now you're out of money or saving it for a family members cancer treatments. Ha. Ha.)

America

Officer down
01-17-03, 05:04 PM
Stump, did I answer your question?

Stump
01-17-03, 05:32 PM
I understood what you are saying, but just don't really agree with it. I know what assault and battery are, so you didn't need to explain that part to me. I would rather see where it is mentioned in the books... but, no big deal...