Police Officer Preparation & Law Enforcement Resource - Archive

The past 2 days in Mansfield have been really snowy, icey and cold. Today in Ontario after aleady being off of the main road, i turned into Lazurus parking lot, as i turned in to the lot and my car fish tailed on some ice as it always does because i have real wheel drive car. There were no cars around to even cause and acident. After gaining control i continued to find a parking space. A couple minutes later a police officer turns his lights on and pulls me over in the mall parking lot. He asked me if i did that on purpose i told him no and explained why it happened. He insisted that i was lying and told me to just tell the truth and he wouldnt cite me. I continued to tell the truth. After him telling me i was lying again he said that he was going to write me a ticket for Reckless Operation. Is this right?? Can an cop pull you over for this and/or on private property?? I was told this was a judgement call of the police officers is that correct??

I am defenatly fighting this citation. I was accused of something that was unture and was told that i was a lier. My girlfriend took pictures with her camra phone of the ice in the parking lot on which i fish taled to take with me to court! Any thing else i should take with me??

Can't help you with Ohio, but here we have a similar charge that can occur anywhere . So even if you're in a paddock away from any road you can still be charged. It's called 'Driving In A Manner Dangerous' and one of the things that helps that charge is a deliberate act of carelessness. Depending on how much you skidded he may be using his judgement to come to the conclusion it was deliberate. I would imagine if we can do it, there would be a similar option for your police. I'd be phoning a local PD or a lawyer to check before comitting yourself to a court hearing. You may end up paying more in legal costs than the fine.

By the way, I'm not saying you skidded on purpose, it's easy to skid on ice and wet weather, but that's not what you asked.

Reckless is enforcable in CA on private property.

Is this right?? Can an cop pull you over for this and/or on private property?? I guess since you got the citation you already have your answer. He did it; therefore, he can.


I am defenatly fighting this citation. I was accused of something that was unture and was told that i was a lier. My girlfriend took pictures with her camra phone of the ice in the parking lot on which i fish taled to take with me to court! Any thing else i should take with me??

Money to pay the fine.

Our airport is considered private property open to the public (as is a mall). I run radar and cite for everything under the moon. So, yes, in TN, it is not an issue on if the infraction occurred "on private property."

If I drove by a house and someone was doing doughnuts in their yard with kids (or property for that matter) standing 10 ft away, they're gettin a reckless citation. ;)

Good luck in court. Sometimes you have to fight for what's right and if you really are telling the truth then let a court tell you you're lying.

No way I would pay a citation that I considered inaccurate without being heard in court. Especially if I was called a liar in the process. That's my opinion.

Just realize you might lose, but also you might win. Every citation taken to court by someone is not in a losing effort, period.

IMHO, you should only contest a citation if you truly believe you were not guilty. This doesn't mean you're right and you'll win, but you'll most likely lose if you're just going to court as a stalling tactic.

However, the thread starter's lack of proper English skills will hurt him in court.

Yes, we can enforce Reckless Driving on private property ( a parking lot open to the public) which comes under a differrent definition under our law. In the driveway of your house, no. Without the officers side of this story, we can't make a true determination of what happened.

Contest it, he might not even show up. You don't have anything to lose, and if you truely believe your not guilty...it may get dropped.

Contest it, he might not even show up. You don't have anything to lose, and if you truely believe your not guilty...it may get dropped.

I would hope he show up to court on a reckless. But as you said, if he doesn't, it will get dropped. With that said, it won't get dropped just because he truly believes he is not guilty.

It isn't what ANYONE except the judge believes. In almost 19 years, I have missed only ONE hearing and the defendant didn't show either. We are BIG on showing up for court.

I would hope he show up to court on a reckless. But as you said, if he doesn't, it will get dropped. With that said, it won't get dropped just because he truly believes he is not guilty.

I have had judges reschedule a court date if the officer wasn't in traffic court that day, especially if it was a pretty significant charge.

Yeah, its pretty ridiculous to think that the courts can't just reschedule if the officer cannot make it.

Old wives tale. Convicted old wives, I bet.

Our traffic court system is kinda jacked. We get 'traffic referees' who are basically defense attorneys who get paid to preside in traffic court. Occassionally you'll get an actual judge. You can already see who the referee sides with I'm sure.

If we are going to miss a court date, we can submit a letter asking for a new court date. One of my friends was going to be out of town on a pre-paid vacation. He got a denial letter because the citizen did not want to waive his right to a speedy trial. Case dismissed....:mad:

The way our system works is the bad guy first goes to court for a 'mention hearing'. At that hearing they are given the opportunity to plead guilty or not guilty. If they plead guilty it's dealt with there and then. We don't go to mention hearings. If they plead not guilty it's adjourned for either a Contest Mention or a full Contest. We go to both of those. A Contest Mention is if there are multiple charges they try to make a deal with us "I'll plead guilty if you drop this, or this."
For Full contest we are rosterd on for the full day at court and we have to arrange for all witnesses to be at court.
There is one another type of hearing where we go and the crook doesn't, called an ex-parte hearing. Usually this is for traffic offences. The offender is served with a copy of the brief of evidence and by them not showing thye are not arguing what's in it. We give a summary of events )sometimes they want more detail) and it's decided there and then.

I hardly ever go to court. Maybe 10 times a year, if that.

Contest it, he might not even show up. You don't have anything to lose, and if you truely believe your not guilty...it may get dropped.

Of course he is going to show up for court, it is his job. In Utah you can be cited for reckless driving on private property. I am sure there are two sides to this story. I have cited kids for reckless for doing similar things. If it is as innocent as you say it is then fight it. If it isn't; think twice before fighting it. The judge is going to look at this as a third person, he is going to look at what appeared to be happening. He won't look at it from the point of view from your drivers seat. My question is this, Did the officer do the same thing when he hit the ice? Our cars are rear wheel drive as well. In icy weather I will use this to help me make decisions, if I can drive properly on the ice and snow, why can't others? If I can drive safely without slipping and sliding everywhere, then there is a very good chance the other people need to do one of two things. Learn how to drive, or stop screwing around.

With that said, If you truely don't feel you were doing anything wrong then fight it. And tell us how it goes.

i contacted a lawyer and he said that if im worried about the points to fight it because the cop was wrong in this situation. Im not sure what im going to do right now i still have a couple of weeks to think about what i want to do.

i contacted a lawyer and he said that if im worried about the points to fight it because the cop was wrong in this situation. Im not sure what im going to do right now i still have a couple of weeks to think about what i want to do.
Of course he did...he either wants your money or he's just running true to form. BTW, can you tell me what good the picture of the ice/snow your girlfriend took is going to do you in court? There pretty much has to be ice and snow for you to do what you did, whatever the reason...and I'm sure the officer is going to testify that there was ice and snow as well.

Partner, every single vehicle I've had has been rear wheel drive, there is only a couple ways to make a car fish tail, jerking around like you were doing, or trying to go up an icy hill-where the rear wheels are pushing the car. Are you sure you weren't doing DONUTS or POWERSLIDES? I admit, I've done both in my early years. You got caught, fess up, pay the fines, and move on in life. No big deal. You were taught something in drivers ed. called CONTROL, you didn't use it, and you got called on it. Unless you are looking at jail time, PAY THE FINES!!!!! :D

Not to defend the above thread starter, but I've fish-tailed on ice too. Not all skids are caused because of intention. Above driver's actions may have been negligent, but it wasn't reckless if everything the poster posted was true.

Not to defend the above thread starter, but I've fish-tailed on ice too. Not all skids are caused because of intention. Above driver's actions may have been negligent, but it wasn't reckless if everything the poster posted was true.

Sure, but there is always "exceeding the safe speed"

YOU are responsible for the actions of YOUR car. If you cannot control it, you are in violation ;)

Too fast for conditions? Sure, my vehicles have slid on ice/snow before, but not to the extent that would warrant a citation. There's a wee bit more to the story than what we know. I tried fighting a ticket once too, first one I ever had issued to me, for a radio too loud. I thought it was a bogus ticket, fought it, and lost my behind. Ended up costing me double the ticket cost. And, yes, my stock radio in my 1978 Plymouth Volare (piss yellow, 4 door) was up too loud, just thought I could win. I learned a huge lesson there, and am trying to keep him from making the same mistake. Own up to your infractions and move on with life.

Reckless Driving can be enforced anyplace except for your private residential drive or a parking lot/garage where a fee is paid for parking or storage. Class B misd. here in Texas which would have gotten you arrested and car towed. As for the lawyer of course he is gonna say the Officer was wrong...Hello it's his job to convince you that we are wrong in what we do that is why they are defense attorney's. He sure is not gonna tell you that you don't have a chance because he would be losing a potential client.

I can site for reckless on private property. If it is a private parking lot with more than 50 spaces i can write for reckless just by what I see. Can't for someone's driveway or yard but if the owner wants to press charges for someone doing donoughts on their property it becomes tresspass.

Stores, Malls, Parking Lots etc etc are not considered private in NC. They are Public Vehicular areas and area not exempt from most road law.

A mall parking lot is definitely not going to fall under the same circumstances as someone's driveway. The lawyer is full of sh**. If you think you can win, go to court...just make sure to post the results....:D

[QUOTE=DC Law]Let's see...YOU drove stupidly but the OFFICER was wrong, and you came HERE to post about it?

--How do you know that i was driving stupidly. Thats your personal opinion. You dont have to post to what i wrote so next time that you want to say something rude that doesnt need to be said if your not answering any of my questions DONT.

jerking around like you were doing, or trying to go up an icy hill-where the rear wheels are pushing the car. Are you sure you weren't doing DONUTS or POWERSLIDES? :D

--By the way you werent there so you cant tell me what i was doing. I know that i fish taled and that it was not done on purpose. So DO NOT tell me what i was or wasnt doing.

Not to defend the above thread starter, but I've fish-tailed on ice too. Not all skids are caused because of intention. Above driver's actions may have been negligent, but it wasn't reckless if everything the poster posted was true.

Thank you very much its about time someone stood up for me. When i am telling the truth. Instead of everyone telling me that im lying.

[QUOTE=seltzer] There's a wee bit more to the story than what we know. [QUOTE]

--Actually i told you everything to the story so stop trying to make me look like a liar when im just trying to shed some light on the situation.

Rule #1. Do not come here asking questions and have a hissy fit when the answers that you get are not the ones you want to hear.


Enjoy the red.

[QUOTE=DC Law]Let's see...YOU drove stupidly but the OFFICER was wrong, and you came HERE to post about it?

--How do you know that i was driving stupidly. Thats your personal opinion. You dont have to post to what i wrote so next time that you want to say something rude that doesnt need to be said if your not answering any of my questions DONT.

Well lets see. Could be because LEO's who work were there are winter conditions like Ice and Snow get pretty good at telling the difference between slides from road conditions and slides from someone jacking around ;)

[QUOTE=seltzer] There's a wee bit more to the story than what we know. [QUOTE]

--Actually i told you everything to the story so stop trying to make me look like a liar when im just trying to shed some light on the situation.

Ok, first off, learn the definition of the word LIAR. Did I call you a liar? Did I imply you were lying? In my OPINION (my THOUGHTS), you simply weren't telling us ALL of the information about your citation. Dude, do you honestly think the police officer would have froze his baggetts off in the snow and ice just to give you some bull**** ticket that he didn't think was justified? Grow up, learn some freakin' respect, and be a man/woman and fess up...a ticket is NOT the end of the world. We were all young once, we all did/have done donuts at some point, the only difference is...you got caught. Simple.

Thank you very much its about time someone stood up for me. When i am telling the truth. Instead of everyone telling me that im lying.

It doesn't matter whether you are telling the truth or not. If you fishtailed on the ice and snow (read carefully and slowly) you were NOT in control of your vehicle! That would make your driving reckless, careless, or whatever it is called in your state. Therefore, you got a traffic ticket. Bring the ticket and your checkbook to the Court, pay the fine, and move on! Or pay the lawyer, and THEN pay the fine as well!

Ok, first off, learn the definition of the word LIAR. Did I call you a liar? Did I imply you were lying? In my OPINION (my THOUGHTS), you simply weren't telling us ALL of the information about your citation. Dude, do you honestly think the police officer would have froze his baggetts off in the snow and ice just to give you some bull**** ticket that he didn't think was justified? Grow up, learn some freakin' respect, and be a man/woman and fess up...a ticket is NOT the end of the world. We were all young once, we all did/have done donuts at some point, the only difference is...you got caught. Simple.


--You dont live where i do to understand how the cops in ontario are. They will do anything to give tickets. Wether you believe that or not. The only reason i posted on this website was not to get critisized or told i was lying was to ask a simple question. This is way more than i asked for and i dont need to hear how stupid i am or im lying just take what you get. So really dont reply anymore i dont care about your opinion of how i was driving i know how i was and thats really all that matters!! :mad:

Well lets see. Could be because LEO's who work were there are winter conditions like Ice and Snow get pretty good at telling the difference between slides from road conditions and slides from someone jacking around ;)


Maybe where you live. Its different with cops from ontario. Dont need to say more because guess what i really dont care for your opinion anymore. :mad:

Rule #1. Do not come here asking questions and have a hissy fit when the answers that you get are not the ones you want to hear.


Enjoy the red.

I came to this site to ask a question yes im not going to deny that i didnt come here to be harassed. Your lying or yes you were doing it on purpose. I asked a simple question that involved that answer not all the extra bs i got along with it. :mad:

The extra BS you are referring to could have been easy to ignore and not show any attention.

The extra BS you are referring to could have been easy to ignore and not show any attention.

You may think so but, i dont like to be called a liar just as much as the next person so thats why i reply. Its done i dont need anymore opinion. Especailly from here! :mad:

So does this mean you'll be leaving us?

You may think so but, i dont like to be called a liar just as much as the next person so thats why i reply. Its done i dont need anymore opinion. Especailly from here! :mad:

Fair enough. Have a nice life. Hope it works out for you.

Maybe where you live. Its different with cops from ontario. Dont need to say more because guess what i really dont care for your opinion anymore. :mad:


Gee sorry I didn't give you the opinion that would totally vindicate you in your mind. I failed in my mission. :eek:

So does this mean you'll be leaving us?

--You sound excited. No i wont sorry to upset you. Thats really childish if that is something you were really looking forward to?! I thought these types of things were to help by giving experience advice or just plain advise. Not to critisize. Ughhh

Fair enough. Have a nice life. Hope it works out for you.

--It's about time. Thank you!

You've sounded so unhappy. Logic says that with you only having 11 posts to which the responses have been less than you hoped for, that this wouldn't be a place you would continue to frequent. Guess I was wrong.

--You sound excited. No i wont sorry to upset you. Thats really childish if that is something you were really looking forward to?! I thought these types of things were to help by giving experience advice or just plain advise. Not to critisize. Ughhh


But you see, they did give you advice, and did help. You just didnt like the answers you got. Up to you if you want to stay, but that little cherry red suare in the upper right hand corner of your profile there will make it difficult for you to be taken as anything but a troll. But if you enjoy the abuse, please, feel free to stick around.